[Milawe]

Originally Posted by Delerak In the spirit of having too much time on my hands I've posted a few videos on the topic of RPI muds. You can view them at my youtube site. YouTube - delerak's Channel thanks.

I'd originally skipped this because I don't spend a lot of time on YouTube. Then I had someone who actually plays Threshold as well as other roleplay enforced games tell me about it because he was offended by the manner in which this video was made.

Delerak, I didn't think badly of you until I saw this video. You really should be ashamed of yourself.

For anyone who sees this video or who doesn't, you'll see Delerek, who has such an obviously biased agenda that he cannot even begin to make an objective video, try to log onto Threshold and "fail miserably".

• Delerak logs in to the mud to "give it a fair try".
• He immediately begins trashing the mud before he's even entered character creation, discussing how the admin has a problem with RPIs (note that the admins have a problem with term RPI as was discussed in this thread), and how he's thankful that Threshold is not an RPI. (We're very thankful as well!)
• He then makes fun of the ease of "getting into the game" when he's only just entered character creation.
• He then goes on to mock the fact that there are races and stats on Threshold and all the information is available and "up front".
• He continues to mock the "ease of entering the game", though he's still not yet past the first screen of creation.
• Notice he states "send in your character application", skips over it and then goes "Stats!"
• Then he gets to his "approve me" part, starts reading out loud because he thinks he's making a point, gets to the "send in a character application", and continues to read silently for a bit.
• Then he decides he's going to "quit now" before he can cause any further embarrassment to Threshold and his mud. (Read that as before he actually has to enter a character application and embarrasses himself any further.)

Then, he logs on to an RPI mud he obviously knows very well (oops, it's his mud) in order to introduce us to the "depth" of RPI gaming. He goes on to discuss how wonderful this RPI is because it's got 6 races and 3 PC restricted races. (A total of 9 just in case anyone has trouble with math.) Then he goes on to proclaim that Threshold has 20 races. Threshold has 10 races; that would be 1, yes 1, more than his beloved RPI. Considering he JUST tried to create on Threshold less than 10 minutes before he goes to create the races, he's either really bad at math, can't count, has a horrible memory, or is a liar of the worst sort. The rest of the video is pretty boring but funny as all heck as he continues to make assumptions about a game he spent less than 5 minutes on and couldn't get past the first room of creation.

Okay, so basically, I get the message. In order to prove how elite and wonderful RPI muds are, you have to go to a non-RPI mud that doesn't even want to be touched with the term RPI, get to screen 1 of character creation, and then make a video to lie about said mud. If all RPI players are like you (thankfully, they're not), I hope the stay the hell away from any mud I ever work on or play on.

You obviously missed out on the fact that Threshold is description based character interaction. Too bad you never got that far since you couldn't manage to get out of room 1 of creation.

Okay, now that I've got that flame out of the way, I've got to also say thank you.

After I got over the initial outrage due to your flat out lies and propaganda, I just had to laugh... a lot. You managed to show that Threshold was easy to use. Your video showed that you weren't expecting a lot of the things you found, which caused long pauses when you were reading to yourself instead of out loud. And ultimately, I haven't seen a video this pathetically funny since "Pharoah Out".

In the end, you made AFS muds look like they cater to a bunch of lying, disrespectful, anal retentive morons who are so biased and ignorant that they can't remember how many races they saw on a screen not even ten minutes prior. I feel bad for them that this video is out there representing them, but I'm adding it to my bookmark so that I have something to entertain myself with when I run into twinks who actually manage to make it onto my mud.

[ShadowsDawn]

Delerak,

First off.. I will admit, I do play Threshold, and have played it for a number of years off and on.

However, I can honestly say that your video was utterly.. disgusting.
You did not even begin to actually pay attention to the character creation Threshold had, or even give it a chance. You stopped before you even actually got started.

The 'approve me' is not a jump into game. It's a run through of making sure you have the basic idea of what the game is, and then you enter a brief writeup of the character you wish to create, or at least a overview of the general type of characters you usually enjoy playing. This is to ensure that you understand that the MUD is focused on RP.

After you get past that.. *then* you are allowed to create your character. Those 'stats' you saw.. really they are only there to measure that category to determine guild eligibility. Everything else.. skill base.. which you'd know if you had actually gone through with things, instead of half-assing it.

All the character creation things you have, are present in Threshold.. age. height.. weight... special features.. Okay, only difference is, to my knowledge you have to wait until you are in game to set up your full on full description.. which has the same requirements as yours does.

I actually went to your game, and looked around. I started making a character, up until the entering the BG, mainly because I was just taking a stroll through it myself. I must say, there are several things that I see as being a rather big no-no in my book. Mainly, providing a player with the appearance of a choice he/she can't make. Races you can't be right now.. hmm not exactly hard to take those, do some coding, and have them only displayed to the people who have the 'points' to play them. Then there's the part of choosing schools.. it says to use 'help school' to find out more.. then what.. no help?

The no help thing is *exactly* why there needs to be some ooc channels, and the player 'in the game' as fast as possible. That way they do have access to people who can help them, and discuss questions they may have.

Now you may be saying that I'm anti-RPI muds. Absolutely wrong. Take a look over at RPIMud. You will see that I am a member there, and have posted about the games. You honestly are the one that I mentioned over there that made me concerned to even be associated with the website/forum. Your elitist attitude is sickening... and I had to fight to keep from dying laughing where you pointed to RPIMuds as a definitive source of what an RPI mud is. None of the things you say are required are mentioned there.. in forums yes.. by a few.. but the main site, where it talks about who can join and all.. nope. Just a few things that are generally seen on them, but that the main intent is that it be a true RP focused game. Course I had to laugh harder still about the fact that the original owner of the Site, left it because of destructive attitudes like yours.

i also find it amusing that you have a video about your being called a 'bad player' and having been banned from Armageddon. You make claims about how you only had one account or didn't do something.. and then a few minutes later go on to say wait.. maybe you did.. can't remember and such. You admitted that you broke the rules there.. and then when you are trying out Threhsold, you break their rules.

Now I am all for things that enhance Roleplay. I am an avid roleplayer. I adore LARP.. because I can costume, I can actually act.. I can make my props.. I get hours.. and sometimes entire weekends of uninterrupted RP with no OOC. But those things that enhance roleplay are generally considered features... not a playstyle. Roleplaying is a playstyle.. Hack&Slash is a playstyle.. Questing is a playstyle.

Oh, another reason to have ooc channels. You even admitted in one of your videos that players *do* break character to share information like emails and IM's. WTF? Why the hubub about having no ooc channels when you do it without them? Provide the channels for those cases.. plus.. hey.. it is a powerful tools for building comraderie amongst all your players. Oh, wait, you calimed that as an actor it is hard for you to act with chatter milling about. Hmm you *do* realize that actors deal with chatter that breaks character *constantly*.. right? Director shouting orders.. giving advice.. lighting crew. OOC chatter is normal.. which.. oh wait.. you have admitted in one of your videos.

You really did a number on yourself with those videos. You just showed that you cannot hold to your stories about anything. Say one thing one moment, and then another the next. Oh, and I love the part of your parents coming in and pretty much thinking your nuts. Oh and.. for the cipes sake.. keep your shirt on.


Oh, I will admit that this is a bit of a rambling mess, but well, there was a lot to talk about, and got to it as I recalled it.

Edit: Oh, and don't say you didn't want to start this thing back up again. You knew what would happen when you made the video and then posted it.

[Threshold]

Oh man. Where do I begin?

"RPI.... ....fighting tooth and nail to try and get us not to use it on TopMudSites"

Once again, this is proof you do not read other people's posts. I never said this, and I do not know anyone who did. You are perfectly free to use the term RPI, but due to its incredibly generic nature, so are other people. If you want exclusive control over a term, proper nouns and specific terminology are better.

I will let people imagine for themselves why are you totally unable to grasp this very simple concept.

"I'm not even going to play his mud because I'd probably die."

LOL! Emo much?

"I don't get it. I didn't really have to do anything. It doesn't make any sense."

You find a clean, easy to use interface confusing? That explains a lot.

"I'm just going to quit now, because I don't want to cause Threshold any further embarassment. I think I got my point across."

I think what you mean is you don't want to give us any more good PR.

I really appreciate you making this nice video that shows how easy it is to use the Threshold character creation interface. That version of character creation was written in 2004 (though it has received minor tweaks here and there over time). I am a perfectionist and I am intensely critical of my own work. I frequently wish I could find time to write a new creation system from scratch. I often worry it is not easy and user friendly enough. Thank you for demonstrating that it is still quite easy to use - even by someone who is doing everything he can to make it look as bad as possible.

Would you send me a copy of your video so I can use it for promotional purposes?

"I can't login to Armageddon because I am banned."

I am so shocked!

"Races. I only have 6, and then 3 that are restricted to PCs. I believe Threshold had like twenty."

So you have 9 races. Threshold has 10 races. Your point? Is 9 the magic number? Is this like the Priest in Monty Python's Holy Grail?

BROTHER: "And the Lord spake, saying, 'First shalt thou make they mud. Then, shalt thou create nine races, no more, no less. Nine shalt be the number thou shalt create, and the number of the creating shalt be nine. Ten shalt thou not create, nor either create thou eight, excepting that thou then proceed to nine. Eleven is right out. Once the number nine, being the ninth number, be reached, then release thou thy Holy RPI of Antioch towards thy foes, who being naughty in my sight, shall snuff them and steal their players.'"

"You don't get to pick your age because people probably didn't keep track of how old they were."

Huh? People have been keeping track of this for thousands of years. You can read about it in the Old Testament. Is Dark Sun pre-speech and pre-mathematics? Like, Cro-magnons?

Do you read books or study history at all? Should you even be making or commenting on muds if your understanding of basic history is this flawed?

I think it is strange that of all the features of your mud you could have demonstrated, this is what you chose. Is this the most unique and "interesting" feature that sets your mud apart from others? Hiding character age? REALLY? That's it? That's your USP? I find that perplexing.

"You don't just create a name, pick a race, and type approve me."

Well, obviously you cut short your creation on Threshold specifically so you could avoid all the other steps. I find it amusing and impossibly coincidental that you stopped RIGHT before the step where you have to write a character outline and get it approved before you can enter the game. You started mumbling under your breath and quickly said something to the effect of: "oh yeah um, we'll stop right now... yeah, that's the ticket!"

After that, you would do things like create your description, eye color, hair color, and pick your general height and weight category (for example: very short, short, average, tall, very tall... sound familiar?). Then you could establish the background heritage for your character, which represents your character's childhood, upbringing, etc.

And those are the parts that determine your short description. So when you are in a room, someone sees "Male elf with dark brown hair" not "Oguma."

In other words, the creation process is actually quite detailed and addresses a lot of role play oriented features. But you deliberately and conveniently stopped before those steps.

"... (quoting a post by Threshold)'For the sake of brevity'. As you can see he is using big words to try and confuse us here."

You think brevity is a big word and claim to play on role play heavy games?

Are language skills this lacking on the games you play and make?

"Hi I'm a level 10 wizard. Nobody talks like that."

Yeah, nobody ever says they are Staff Sergant Smith, right? Oh wait. They do. Ooops.

In competitive gymnastics in the US, kids are specifically divided up by level. They literally call it levels. I believe the levels are 1 through 10. To attain different levels, you have to be able to perform certain types of gymnastic maneuvers. So one is literally a "level 8 gymnast", and they refer to themselves in such a manner. This method of classification goes all the way up to competing for the National team.

I have never said level systems are the best or only way to do things. But to claim the concept of levels are "OOC" is simply ignorant of reality. But hey, don't let facts get in the way of your rant.

--------------------------------------------------

Delerak, you are a sad, sad, sad, hilarious man.

I have never seen a more unintentionally hilarious backfire of a flame attempt. If I were not the target of this video, I would think this was an elaborate scam to give Threshold more publicity and positive press. Please do not EVER, EVER, EVER take that video down.

As funny as this failed flame was, absolutely nothing touches the awesomeness of your other videos, like this one:

Armageddon MUD Videocast - Delerak the Myth, the Legend

I am not sure what my favorite part was.... It is hard to decide between you doing pushups, your random lack of a shirt in the final 30 seconds, or when you parents walk in to ask you to do some kind of chore, ask you what you are doing, and you have to lie to them and say you are doing an interview with Microsoft. Hahahahahahaha. Ok, its the parents coming it. That is just awesome.

[Delerak]

Most of the videos aren't meant to get my point across, a lot of you have failed to realize that they're supposed to be funny/spoof videos. It's hard enough to get your point across on a forums, trying to do it in a video is 10 times harder, if you think you can do better, please go ahead. The videos aren't meant to be taken seriously, I posted the link hoping to alleviate some of the seriousness behind RPI's but yet again I've failed it seems to even do that, with what is blatantly not a collection of serious thoughts at all. Every single video from start to finish is improvisation, not a thing is written down or collected as a whole thought-- which is the whole point.

I mean come on, in the middle of the videos I even put the dumbest stuff (the world of warcraft bit) that has nothing to do with the video at all. If that's not enough to prove that the videos are not meant to be taken serious I don't know what is.

I really wish people didn't take things so serious, although at least SOME people on these forums did laugh at them, which is the POINT of the videos.

But whatever, people can believe whatever they want, if I felt the need to do a collection of videos that are actually thougthful and not a satire towards something I would probably take an hour or two, write down my points, collect data, cite references and then do a video about 1 subject instead of having a bunch of stuff rolled into one video.

Unreal. You guys need to learn to laugh..heh.

[Delerak]

I still can't get over how many people seem to be taking these videos seriously.. haha.

Got a couple of threshold players flaming me now. This is great.

[Threshold]

Dude, don't worry. We were all laughing uproariously. Unintentional comedy is still comedy, and is still entertaining.

I watched a total crap movie last night (No Country for Old Men.... one of the worst movies I have seen in at least a year), and then sat down to the computer and discovered your videos. Your videos washed away all the bitterness over wasting 2 hours on that movie and replaced it with a good hour of laugh out loud entertainment.

I probably wasn't laughing for the reasons you intended though.

[Delerak]

Originally Posted by Threshold Dude, don't worry. We were all laughing uproariously. Unintentional comedy is still comedy, and is still entertaining. I watched a total crap movie last night (No Country for Old Men.... one of the worst movies I have seen in at least a year), and then sat down to the computer and discovered your videos. Your videos washed away all the bitterness over wasting 2 hours on that movie and replaced it with a good hour of laugh out loud entertainment. I probably wasn't laughing for the reasons you intended though.

As long as you're laughing I honestly don't care. They're not meant to be taken seriously. If you didn't notice that within the first 2 minutes of every video I have (except for the RPI viewpoint one) then you're daft. If you think you can do better at satiring the subject of RPI's vs non-RPI's go right ahead. I'm waiting to see your comedic genius.

I have to go for a bit, but when I get back I'll try to do another SPECIAL video just for you guys.

[Threshold]

That sounds like the Jon Stewart (or any "political comedian" for that matter) dodge:

Step 1: Attack something or someone - the more bitter and vitriolic the attack the better.

Step 2: If critical praise is received, puff up your chest and act like you are brilliant.

Step 3: If criticism is received, or if anyone points out glaring flaws in the attack's "logic", say: "Hey, I'm a comedian, I'm trying to be funny, its a joke."

Generally, the real joke is the person using this dodge.

No Delerak, your intent was very clear and your bitterness was even clearer. In the two videos linked here already, you were trying to make attacks and they blew up in your face. The parts that were funny were the unintentional comedy (like your parents walking in to tell you to do some chores, and you had to lie to them about being in an interview with Microsoft). The parts where you were trying to be funny (like the WoW teamspeak part, or the pushups) were just kinda weird and made the viewer embarrassed for you.

But by all means, keep making videos.

[ShadowsDawn]

Oh, I was laughing, don't worry about that.

I've been following this conversation for a while, and have remained silent for the most part. I spoke up only when I just couldn't keep from saying something anymore.

Your video on Threshold was one such incident. I had watched the others.. had a good laugh at your expense and moved on. But the half-assed comparison between your game and Thresholds. Yeah, that I'm going to take offense to, and call someone out on.. and then well.. all the stuff that had annoyed me from this thread came out.

Oh btw... I wasn't flaming you as a Threshold player. Yes I play the game.. have been for approaching 9 years now.. but like I've said, I play it off and on but it is still the only mud I really do play. I posted because I personally, as a game designer, took offense to it. Didn't matter what game you used for this, I would have gone, looked at them and then likely have responded in the same exact way.

Honestly, satire or not, your videos were in the general tone I've seen come from you through this whole thing, so they realy just did little more than serve as a showcase to thoroughly discredit you in every possible way for me.

[Delerak]

Originally Posted by Threshold That sounds like the Jon Stewart (or any "political comedian" for that matter) dodge: Step 1: Attack something or someone - the more bitter and vitriolic the attack the better. Step 2: If critical praise is received, puff up your chest and act like you are brilliant. Step 3: If criticism is received, or if anyone points out glaring flaws in the attack's "logic", say: "Hey, I'm a comedian, I'm trying to be funny, its a joke." Generally, the real joke is the person using this dodge. No Delerak, your intent was very clear and your bitterness was even clearer. In the two videos linked here already, you were trying to make attacks and they blew up in your face. The parts that were funny were the unintentional comedy (like your parents walking in to tell you to do some chores, and you had to lie to them about being in an interview with Microsoft). The parts where you were trying to be funny (like the WoW teamspeak part, or the pushups) were just kinda weird and made the viewer embarrassed for you. But by all means, keep making videos.

If I had more time to respond I would, but I'm just checking in. If you fail to realize that I can cut any part of the videos then I may as well just give up right here and now.

I left it in because it was intentional. I'm not going to go over my videos for people who fail to realize what's even going on in them.

[Fifi]

Originally Posted by Mina In the end, you made AFS muds look like they cater to a bunch of lying, disrespectful, anal retentive morons who are so biased and ignorant that they can't remember how many races they saw on a screen not even ten minutes prior. I feel bad for them that this video is out there representing them, but I'm adding it to my bookmark so that I have something to entertain myself with when I run into twinks who actually manage to make it onto my mud.

My dog in this fight is this one. You can't possibly believe that the RPI community is really catering to: "a bunch of lying, disrespectful, anal retentive morons who are so biased and ignorant that they can't remember how many races they saw on a screen not even ten minutes prior.

And in the following sentence do you really mean that we're all twinks? That seems a bit heavy handed.

I know a lot of RPI (AFS?) players and in so far as I'm aware most of us don't eat babies.

[Delerak]

Originally Posted by Mina Delerak, I didn't think badly of you until I saw this video. You really should be ashamed of yourself. For anyone who sees this video or who doesn't, you'll see Delerek, who has such an obviously biased agenda that he cannot even begin to make an objective video, try to log onto Threshold and "fail miserably". Delerak logs in to the mud to "give it a fair try". He immediately begins trashing the mud before he's even entered character creation, discussing how the admin has a problem with RPIs (note that the admins have a problem with term RPI as was discussed in this thread), and how he's thankful that Threshold is not an RPI. (We're very thankful as well!) He then makes fun of the ease of "getting into the game" when he's only just entered character creation. He then goes on to mock the fact that there are races and stats on Threshold and all the information is available and "up front". He continues to mock the "ease of entering the game", though he's still not yet past the first screen of creation. Notice he states "send in your character application", skips over it and then goes "Stats!" Then he gets to his "approve me" part, starts reading out loud because he thinks he's making a point, gets to the "send in a character application", and continues to read silently for a bit. Then he decides he's going to "quit now" before he can cause any further embarrassment to Threshold and his mud. (Read that as before he actually has to enter a character application and embarrasses himself any further.) Then, he logs on to an RPI mud he obviously knows very well (oops, it's his mud) in order to introduce us to the "depth" of RPI gaming. He goes on to discuss how wonderful this RPI is because it's got 6 races and 3 PC restricted races. (A total of 9 just in case anyone has trouble with math.) Then he goes on to proclaim that Threshold has 20 races. Threshold has 10 races; that would be 1, yes 1, more than his beloved RPI. Considering he JUST tried to create on Threshold less than 10 minutes before he goes to create the races, he's either really bad at math, can't count, has a horrible memory, or is a liar of the worst sort. The rest of the video is pretty boring but funny as all heck as he continues to make assumptions about a game he spent less than 5 minutes on and couldn't get past the first room of creation. Okay, so basically, I get the message. In order to prove how elite and wonderful RPI muds are, you have to go to a non-RPI mud that doesn't even want to be touched with the term RPI, get to screen 1 of character creation, and then make a video to lie about said mud. If all RPI players are like you (thankfully, they're not), I hope the stay the hell away from any mud I ever work on or play on. You obviously missed out on the fact that Threshold is description based character interaction. Too bad you never got that far since you couldn't manage to get out of room 1 of creation. Okay, now that I've got that flame out of the way, I've got to also say thank you. After I got over the initial outrage due to your flat out lies and propaganda, I just had to laugh... a lot. You managed to show that Threshold was easy to use. Your video showed that you weren't expecting a lot of the things you found, which caused long pauses when you were reading to yourself instead of out loud. And ultimately, I haven't seen a video this pathetically funny since "Pharoah Out". In the end, you made AFS muds look like they cater to a bunch of lying, disrespectful, anal retentive morons who are so biased and ignorant that they can't remember how many races they saw on a screen not even ten minutes prior. I feel bad for them that this video is out there representing them, but I'm adding it to my bookmark so that I have something to entertain myself with when I run into twinks who actually manage to make it onto my mud.

Okay, I'll try my best here.

Do I have a biased agenda? No, do I have an agenda? Yes. To prove my point which I could not prove in this thread, the fact remains that RPI's differ, the character creation is only one of many aspects that differ and make RPI's have superior roleplaying and atmosphere. It's harder to get into an RPI mud then it is other normal muds. RPI's are like an exclusive club where most people can't get in due to ignorance like your post you've made here.

First of all, if you're going to list what I do in the video, at least admit that most of my comments are sarcasm. If you cannot detect this then you have a long ways to go in social settings. A LOT of what I say in my videos is not to be taken serious, this is obvious by my tone of voice. The only video I have so far is the RPI viewpoints video I posted, and the difference between that video and my others is quite obvious. If you'd like I'll provide the dialogue of my video so people can see just how ridiculous it is that you guys take my comments to heart.

Wow.. I don't even know if I should reply to the thing about logging into my own mud. I even stated that I'm showing favoritism by logging into my mud, but at the same time, it still proves my point for character creation. Yes I admit during this part of the video I did go off on tangeants about the features my own mud has during character creation but is this not the point? My point was that the character creation for RPI muds is far more in-depth and I proved that, and I didn't even get 30% into the character creation process of my mud.

In my next video I did get out of ROOM 1 of character creation and I have to say I wasn't impressed, my point still stands.

[Newworlds]

Delerak. I will say this as succinctly and kindly as possible. You have sunken to a alltime low. Whether your video was a joke or not, it was extremely poor taste, offensive, and childish. Something we as Admin of MUDs should be above. We are the elite in games and epic roleplay not 13 year olds.

You owe Threshold an apology.