[less than sacred]

Dark Hope MUD is a player's mud. Built entirely with the players in mind.

Features inlude:
A rich detailed world with many original areas and quests spread out over a vast realm so players have elbow room.
Player owned clans
200+ mortal levels
Dual-class at level 100
A battle system for PK and other events
The friendliest and most helpful imms on the 'net
Original class such as the menacing Warlock
Ancient items called "Artifacts" that can be customized and learn skills.

Plus so much more!

We've just opened and we're small but I can assure that we offer on the best online gaming experiences anywhere!

Visit us at
http://darkhope.cjb.net
or darkhope.cjb.net port 6777 to connect to us.

Anything is possible!

[KaVir]

Three adverts on the same day? Please, try and show a little consideration for the other posters.

[OnyxFlame]

I'd like to know what's so bleeping original about having levels, heh.

[less than sacred]

Ahh yes, two other mud admins.
Thanks for posting and keeping this at the top. I really appreciate it.
Seriously though, my intention is not annoy anyone. There's plenty of room here for enveryone.

Btw, levels or not, Dark Hope is still one of the most unique and original games around. Don't believe me? Come and see for yourself.

[Brody]

At the risk of perpetuating this: Regardless of whether the two who complained admin their own MUDs, KaVir also moderates for the forums here at Top MUD Sites. They didn't get on your case because you're "the little guy." The fact is, when you spam the advertising forum, you reduce its value by creating more noise versus useful signal.

As the ambassador of your game, consider the reputation you want to develop. You can be the guy who flies in the face of local propriety and tweaks the Powers That Be when they criticize you, or you can just acknowledge that you probably don't need to advertise that much in a single day and agree to show more restraint in the future.

[macdaddy7]

Well for one thing, he didn't post all those in a single day, he posted them over a two days period and the other two are currently gone so does it really matter? You are those ones leaving this post on the board, so why dont you stop posting and let it drop rather than keeping it there?

[less than sacred]

I don't want any bad blood with anybody. But people tend to get a bit uptight. And I offer apologies to anyone that may have been upset by my or anybody else from my mud's action. In all honesty though if someone complains about my extent of advertising it's really not that hard to post on this board to promote your own mud. Isn't that what it's here for?

Actually it may promote some good advertising for a lot of games that people may not have ordinarily known about.

However I'll do my best to limit the extent at which myself, or my players keep from "hogging" the board. But I warn you, as with any mud, the players on Dark Hope can be quite loyal; so if there are a few slip-ups, I sincerely apologize in advance.

[Brody]

LTS,

It's all good. Thanks. And if your loyal and enthusiastic players want to write substantial reviews about your game, march them right on over to the reviews section .

And, yeah, more games should promote themselves and take advantage of the resource here in this forum.

Welcome to the party.

[KaVir]

Originally Posted by Well for one thing, he didn't post all those in a single day, he posted them over a two days period and the other two are currently gone so does it really matter?

He posted three adverts on the same day (at 03:04, 04:33 and 23:22), and they are still in place. Tell me, what do you think would happen if every mud admin on TMS posted three adverts per day?

Originally Posted by You are those ones leaving this post on the board, so why dont you stop posting and let it drop rather than keeping it there?

Ignoring a problem won't make it go away. I simply asked him to show a little consideration for the other posters. Hopefully other mud admin will also read this, and do the same.

Originally Posted by Btw, levels or not, Dark Hope is still one of the most unique and original games around. Don't believe me? Come and see for yourself.

Okay, if you insist.

[code] <20hp 100m 96mv> l
< -=*=- > Mud School Entrance < -=*=- >
[Exits; north up down]
This is the entrance to the Merc Mud School. Go north to go through mud
school. If you have been here before and want to go directly to the arena,
go south.

<20hp 100m 96mv> time
It is 1 o'clock pm, Day of the Moon, 28th the Month of the Heat.
EnvyMud started up Fri Aug 15 21;10;32 2003
The system time is Sat Aug 16 03;57;06 2003

<20hp 100m 100mv> slist
ALL Abilities available.

Lv Abilities

1; parry
4; dodge
5; kick
7; enhanced damage
8; rescue
9; shield block
12; stun
15; disarm
17; hack
19; dual
20; bash door
22; second attack
23; whirlwind
31; third attack
32; berserk
40; fast healing
45; battle cry
50; fourth attack
58; counter attack
71; smash

<20hp 100m 100mv> d

<> YOU ARE NOW ENTERING [ All } Envy Midgaard ] <>

[- + -] The Temple of Midgaard [- + -]
[Exits; north south up]
You are in the southern end of the temple hall in the Temple of Midgaard.
The temple has been constructed from giant marble blocks, eternal in
appearance, and most of the walls are covered by ancient wall paintings
picturing Gods, Giants and peasants.
Large steps lead down through the grand temple gate, descending the huge
mound upon which the temple is built and ends on the temple square below.
Equally large steps lead UP through a small door into the ENTRANCE to MUD
SCHOOL. (type 'up' to go to MUD SCHOOL.) A small plaque is on this wall.

(White Aura) Victor, the Enforcer of Midgaard is here.

<20hp 100m 100mv> help
MOVEMENT GROUP
north south east west up down follow group gtell split
exits recall
sleep wake rest stand

OBJECTS INFORMATION / COMMUNICATION
get put drop give sacrifice help credits areas commands socials
donate wear wield hold report score time weather where who
recite quaff zap brandish channels config description password title
lock unlock open close pick bash auction chat music question answer shout yell
inventory equipment look compare emote pose say tell grats clantalk
eat drink fill bug idea typo
list buy sell value note wizlist slist spells autoexit
autoloot autosac blank brief combine prompt

COMBAT OTHER
kill flee kick rescue disarm ! save quit pagelength
backstab cast wimpy practice train

For more help, type 'help <topic>' for any command, skill, or spell.
Also help on; DAMAGE DEATH EXPERIENCE NEWS STORY TICK

<20hp 100m 100mv> help story
One hundred and fifty years ago ...

Nomads from the Great Eastern desert brought spices and slaves to the Thalos
Market. Dwarven miners, rough and rude, sold precious stones and drank the
town dry of firebreathers. Stone golems, created by mages from the Tower of
High Sorcery, stood sentry duty in the watch towers.

It was dawn on the Day of Thunder. The Mayor of Midgaard (great-grand-father
of today's Mayor) arrived early to pay tribute at City Hall. He entered the
Grand Gate unchallenged. He found the streets and markets empty. Seeing a
nearby lamia, he asked her about the residents. Where were all the people?

The lamia didn't act like a lamia. Instead of answering him in the helpful but
stupid lamia manner, she stabbed the Mayor with a long, slim dagger. Other
lamias, hearing the tumult, arrived and attacked. The Mayor was killed.

Now Thalos is abandoned. Wild lamias roam the streets, killing intruders and
sacrificing their bodies at the Temple of Thalos. The golems no longer respond
to command and now watch eternally from their ruined towers.

Midgaard is next.

<20hp 100m 100mv> help news
New UltraEnvy (HomeCooked) features as of version 0.87;
I've worked like a slave this summer to do this... Enjoy! - Zen

Areas;
Zen's Arena
Maniac's Mythran Mud Casino

Features;
Damage classes.
Resistant, Immune, Susceptible flags.
Ranged Weapons - see also SHOOT.
HIT FUN's.
WIZNET.
Dice games.
ANSI color code.
ARENA code.
Better CLANS code.
Hunt/Track.
MobPrograms - see also MOBINFO.
Online Creation using ILAB OLC - see help OLC.
Several new spells, too numerous to list.
Several new skills, too numerous to list.
Sacrifice and Remove changed so commands such as "sacrifice all.corpse" are
possible.

Changes;
Smarter Mobs
Ridable Mobs
Command history - see also HISTORY
Aliases - see also ALIAS
Mana types. Gems to boost spell casting - see also MANA
Password and Retire commands now don't show your password


New Envy features as of version 2.2;

Commands;
"whois" gives information on characters.
Many socials added by Binky and Katrina.

Areas;
Binky's Circus
Solace

Features;
Psionicist class added, with 40-some spells (coded entirely by Thelonius).
Bash Door skill for Warriors, as well as spec_repairman to fix bashed doors.
Poison Weapon skill for Thieves.
Dispel Magic now works.

Purgatory added, so corpse retrieval parties are not necessary.

Changes;
50 mortal levels instead of 36.
Dragon breath spells, now available to mages for many levels, have increased
mana cost and waitstate.
Changed linked-list structure updates char_list, object_list, and extra
descriptions every tick in one function rather than instantaneously in many
different functions.
Reduced memory requirements because of list_update change.[/quote]

[less than sacred]

Originally Posted by Ignoring a problem won't make it go away. I simply asked him to show a little consideration for the other posters. Hopefully other mud admin will also read this, and do the same.

What part of I didn't want any bad blood did you get? I thought what I said that was fairly simple and easy to understand. Attempting to make an example out of me like some 12 year on a free board where the number of daily posts "isn't" restricted even though the posts where made of a series of days, not hours as you would seem to make out.

I did three frickin' harmelss posts. And I will not stand by and let you make me look like I did something wrong. I didn't.
And your stupid log is nicely edited to reflect your slanted point of view.

All I wanted to do was say I'm sorry and let it bet that, but no. You have to act like a real jerk and try make myself, my mud, and my players look bad.

I figured TMS was a place for mature mud prmotion and discussion. I see that it's like all the other mud sites out there. Full of immature people.

Ya know what, y'all can take your crappy ass site and shove it! Years of hard work and effort went into my mud. I'm not going to let some idiot on a mission ruin everything I've worked for. So you guys can have this place. If TMS is reflective of the mudder community it's no wonder I feel out of place. I've outgrown it.

[Jazuela]

less than sacred:

When I was new to this forum, people trashed my posts left and right, for what I believed to be ridiculous reasons. At the time, I was not part of the mudding community. Once I allowed myself to get over the annoyance of being trashed, I started reading some of the posts in the forum that didn't involve or concern me, and found it to be very well-coordinated.

I still feel that I was trashed for stupid reasons, and think that yes, sometimes people -can- be overbearing here sometimes.

However in your case, I noted in each of your responding posts that you included a "challenge;" a "I double dare you!" quip that just screamed for someone to call you on it and put you down.

It's difficult to hold your tongue when you're used to being in charge of things, and coming to a new place thinking you'll be accepted immediately. It's even more difficult to back down and say "well maybe they're being this way because I didn't give them a chance to accept me before I went all clever on them, and they're thinking who the heck is THIS, trampling all over our boards being clever and trying to force themselves into our group?

You can't force yourself to be accepted in a forum that's been established and running as it has been for as long as it's been running. I learned this the hard way. Hopefully you won't have to - they're being VERY tame with you, I got a lot worse.

As for the issue at hand:

It is considered polite that when you have one thread already on the top of the "view recent threads" list on the main webpage, that you not add more threads until it disappears. In the mudconnector website, they actually have a written policy that requests that posters wait a month (or maybe a week?) before posting another promotion for the same game.

I did try to find a policy statement here, but after 10 minutes of searching I didn't find it. If it does exist, it should be a special link in part of the main forum menu so anyone can view it at any time without having to look for it first.

If it doesn't exist, I propose to Synozeer that perhaps it should.

In the meantime, calm down, go visit the mudconnector and roll your eyes at all the flames and insults that run rampant there, and come back here in a week, refreshed and eager to try again.

Good luck, and may the force be with you

[WarHound]

Sacred: I think everyone ewas just asking that you not 'spam' the boards. There are five, I believe, slots on the most recent discussions section of the main page. When you have three of your own there, it just seems like spam to me, and obviously others.

KaVir wasn't trying to be an ass, I'm sure, but after watching for a few months, I know regardless of his intentions he comes off that way sometimes Just kiddin' KaVir...

But, you tearing off and flaming the posters and TMS altogether, does nothing but make You and your mud look bad. I know I for one will NEVER come play it now that I've seen how childish you become after only a bit of prodding.

I think you'll come to see that, if you plan on running a successful mud, then you'll have to deal with ALOT more problems than a few people poking at you on TMS. Angry players and builders are MUCH MUCH MUCH more adament about thier displeasures, and you'll need to control yourself, and refrain from hissy fits like we've seen here.

I don't have two cents, so that'll have to do.

[macdaddy7]

If you read his earlier post, you would see that he said his MUD was being remodeled for a year before it was reopened, so he did run a successful MUD for years before that and it had a well established player base. And he wasn't calling anyone out in his earlier postings, he was first just trying to promote his MUD and in no way broke the rules, then with his post he said he didn't want any trouble, how is that starting conflict. Do you think if you hadn't responded to it he would still be posting? I doubt it. And thanks KaVir, that really did make the MUD look good.

[Davairus]

Kavir does bring to light something which you have missed. Your login sequence and first 5 minutes on the MUD still look pretty stock. Remember that the first 5 minutes a player spends trying out a MUD are often the most crucial to lots of players.. especially the old hands from the mud scene. You got midgaard references and an EnvyMUD thing in there, etc.. far as I know theres nothing wrong with changing those to your own names.

Good luck with the reopening.

[KaVir]

Originally Posted by Attempting to make an example out of me like some 12 year on a free board where the number of daily posts "isn't" restricted

I asked you to "try and show a little consideration for the other posters".  Tell me, do you respond to player suggestions with that same sort of attitude?

Originally Posted by even though the posts where made of a series of days, not hours as you would seem to make out.

It's not a good idea to try and back up your claims by lying when everyone reading this forum can easily check the facts for themselves:

Thread "Gold Bonus added to Dark Hope MUD" by less than sacred, advert posted Aug. 14 2003,03:04.

Thread "Dark Hope MUD is open for business!" by less than sacred, advert posted Aug. 14 2003,04:33.

Thread "Great mud seeking players!!" by less than sacred, advert posted Aug. 14 2003,23:22.

Originally Posted by And your stupid log is nicely edited to reflect your slanted point of view.

No, my log is cut & paste, taken directly from your mud.  Once again, anyone can see that for themselves simply by logging in.

Originally Posted by All I wanted to do was say I'm sorry and let it bet that,

If that's what you wanted to say, then that's what you should have said.  But instead you stated "Btw, levels or not, Dark Hope is still one of the most unique and original games around.  Don't believe me?  Come and see for yourself".  I didn't really care, but as you had specifically asked me to have a look, that's exactly what I did.  And it turns out that your mud is practically stock.  If you didn't want me to reveal that, then you really shouldn't have asked me to come and see for myself.

Originally Posted by but no.  You have to act like a real jerk and try make myself, my mud, and my players look bad.

The only person who has made you look bad is you, by demonstrating that you are unable to accept even a polite suggestion, and have no interest in respecting the other posters.  The only reason your mud looks bad is because you challenged me to take a look at how original it is, and I pointed out that it's stock.  And I've not commented on your players at all (in fact I didn't even see any when I logged on, although that's not unusual for a stock mud).

Originally Posted by Years of hard work and effort went into my mud.

Then may I tactfully suggest you don't give up your day job?

[less than sacred]

Riiiiiight..

Can you lie any more? I mean that's all you've done so far. Yeah, the login screen was stock. Character creation was stock...suuure. I see many muds with my custom coded dice rolling system. But you conviently ommited that part. Sure, Midgaard comes with all merc/envy muds but you forgot to let us see the changes, new mobs, new colors, new items, new quest, etc etc.

You forgot to type areas and show us all 125 areas that are in place. Sure, walking around recall for 2 minutes can show you a lot about a mud. Stock my ass.

You're a liar. Plain and simple. I'll say it again a L-I-A-R.
Liar! And to me there's nothing worse on this planet.

Of course all the kiss-asses will fall in line right behind. But that's them, not me. I apologized once and I wasn't even in the wrong. But never again. I was ok with being cool and letting the whole thing drop. But no, you had to be a dickhead. So go ahead and be a dickhead.

KaVir the liar. Enjoy the title. You've earned it.

[Jazuela]

Well so much for being diplomatic and polite. Less than sacred, I submit that you are, indeed, less than sacred. Far less, IMNSHO.

KaVir is a lot of things. Pompous, arrogant, wrong on occasion, beligerent once in awhile, and a pain in the ass to anyone who flips him off. But in my experience reading this forum and his posts in the mudconnector, and his own websites, I have yet to see him lie. About anything.

He is absolutely right in his assessment of the player's perception upon entering a game. The first five minutes can make or break you. Just as in real life, appearances count, and first impressions count most.

If I showed up in your game and saw the word Midgaard in anything other than the credits, I'd walk right out without bothering to go any further. KaVir saved me the trouble.

I have no desire to spend the first hour of any game in a stock newbie school doing the same thing that drives me nuts in half the other games I check out.

I don't care that you have 127 original areas. If the FIRST ROOM I show up in isn't original, I'll chalk it up to a lazy attempt or a newbie coder who isn't really a coder at all, but instead just some kid learning how to upload existing code to a port. I'm not a coder and even I could do better than that. And you better believe I would do better than that if I actually wanted to attract people to any game I was creating.

So take your temper tantrum and find someone else to blow it at. You've already shown everyone the kind of IMP people will have to endure if they try your game, and I'm confident that it's only caused you potential players who will now glady look elsewhere.

[KaVir]

I have not lied about anything.  Once again I reiterate; if you didn't want me showing everyone that your mud is stock, you shouldn't have asked me to take a look.  Sure, you've made one or two minor changes, but you're still well within the definition of "stock mud".

Originally Posted by Yeah, the login screen was stock.

I omitted to mention the login screen.  Do you think the login screen is what makes your mud "one of the most unique and original games around"?

Originally Posted by Character creation was stock...suuure.  I see many muds with my custom coded dice rolling system

Yes, it is a stock feature on a number of codebases, such as the 1995 version of God Wars.  The only new part of character creation that I could see was the "minimun requirements" (spelling yours) thing, which apparently doesn't work anyway:

[code] You have met the minimun requirements for the following classes;
[ Mage(Mag) Thief(Thi) Bard(Bar) Warlock(Wlk) ]; war

_
 The WARRIOR class is the most basic fighting class available.  Their
 battle training along with high strength and high hit points make them
 very formidable in hand to hand combat.  WARRIORs train in the art of
 multiple attacks.  Some master the art of a SECOND ATTACK and if experienced
 enough, master a THIRD ATTACK.  Along with this training in multiple
 attacks, a WARRIOR is trained in making each hit count.  ENHANCED DAMAGE
 is available to only the learned.  Toward the defense side of the WARRIOR,
 skills of PARRY, RESCUE and BASH DOOR allow the WARRIOR to ward off attacks,
 rush to the aid of fellow comrades, and open doors rather barbarically.
___
Are you sure you want this class?
y

Do you want ANSI colour (Y/N)?[/quote]

(Note: For some reason TMS strips out the class title, which is displayed just above the description).

Originally Posted by You forgot to type areas and show us all 125 areas that are in place.

There are a lot of parts I didn't post - there is only so much space - but everything I did post was correct.  However as you insist, here is your area list:

[code] {   All   } Envy      Limbo
{   3  50 } Hatchet   Murky Land
{         }
{   All   } Maniac    Mythran Mud Casino
{  15  30 } Envy      Smurf Village
{  10  52 } Zen       Steel Cage Arena
{   All   } Picard    The River
{  50  90 } Karl      The Highlands
{   1  20 } Copper    Plains of The North
{  10  26 } Manx      Goblin Caves
{   All   } Envy      Purgatory
{  15  25 } Boom      Shaolin Temple
{  15  50 } Hatchet   New Ofcol
{   All   } Calythia  Battlegrounds
{  15  50 } Envy      Olympus
{         }
{   5  10 } Copper    In the Air
{   1  10 } Envy      The Ruins
{   5  25 } Anon      The Shire
{  50  70 } Envy      Hollywood
{  51  54 } Envy      Gods' Rooms
{   All   } Envy      Lost Trail
{  10  30 } Anon      High Tower of Sorcery
{         }
{   5  15 } Vougon    Gnome Village
{  15  25 } Theodryck Lowbieland Tower
{   5  30 } Tyrst     Wyvern's Tower
{   5  15 } Alfa      Moria
{  10  30 } Mahatma   Little Haven
{  15  40 } Envy      The Caverns
{  15  35 } Andi      The Astral Plane
{   All   } Envy      Clan
{  10  20 } Raff      Dwarven Catacombs
{         }
{   5  15 } Raff      Dangerous Neighboorhood
{   All   } Saza      Rumble Arena
{   5  50 } Wench     Dragon Tower
{  50  60 } Envy      Water World
{  15  35 } Chris     The Keep of Mahn-Tor
{   All   } Theodryck Granite Road
{   5  50 } Casret    Ultima
{  80 120 } Theodryck Home of The Skyfather
{   5  35 } Andi      The Great Pyramid
{   All   } Theodryck o0O()Rocky Road()O0o
{   All   } Jerrik    Guild Halls
{  70  90 } Kantara   The Redwood
{  10  15 } Envy      Troll Den
{  13  50 } Silence   Underdark
{  70 100 } Nirrad    Land of The Fire Newts
{  20  50 } Merriman  Mirror Realm
{   All   } Envy      Midgaard
{   All   } AoI       AoI Roads
{  15  25 } Copper    Chapel Catacombs
{  35  45 } Yaegar    Wonderland
{  50  70 } Copper    Miden'nir
{  20  50 } Yaegar    Underworld
{   5  10 } Alfa      Graveyard
{ 120 170 } Theodryck Castle of Lord Soth
{   1   5 } Hatchet   Mud School
{  30 100 } Theodryck Unamil's Cavern
{   2  10 } Hatchet   The Rats Lair
{   All   } Theodryck Dark Forest Path
The Circus
{  50  80 } Theodryck Ancient City
{  10  25 } Anon      Kingdom of Juargan
{  80 120 } Pyros/Saza Keltak Bone Field
{  10  20 } Anon      Eastern Dessert
{   All   } Theodryck <*>Infinity Pass<*>
{  15  25 } Anon      Drow City
{  50  80 } Saza      Woods of Suicide
{  10  25 } Anon      Thalos
{  20  60 } Saza      Dead Solace
{   All   } Alfa      Ofcol
{   All   } Theodryck More Roads
{   All   } Alfa      Ofcol
{ 120 200 } Theodryck Mountain of The Colossus
{   All   } Saza      Forstyh Road
{ 130 100 } Jerrik    Desert
{ 170 220 } Kantara   Eternia
{ 130 100 } Jerrik    Desert
{   5  20 } Mahatma   Arachnos
{  80 100 } Jerrik    The Cliffs of Sorrow
{   5  10 } Envy      Haon Dor
{  80 100 } Jerrik    Great Eastern Ocean
{  10  25 } Anon      Dwarven Kingdom
{  10 30  } Pyros     Midgaard Zoo
{   1   5 } Sandman   Dwarven Daycare
{   ALL   } Theodryck Bandit's Pass
{   5  30 } Envy      Sewers
{   ALL   } Theodryck Swamp Lane
{   5  20 } Hatchet   Valley of The Elves
{ 100 120 } Jerrik    Zyra Mountains
{  20  30 } Envy      RedFerne's Residence
{ 120 140 } Jerrik    City of Zyra
{ 100 170 } Saza      Mega-City One
{ 140 160 } Jerrik    Yeti Village
{  20  45 } Forstal   Planes of Nirvana
{ 160 180 } Jerrik    Gal'Mar
{  60  90 } Mort      Castle Reinhold
{ 130 160 } Jerrik    Darkness and Light
{  30  50 } Envy      Old Marsh
{  70 120 } Zurix     Secret Society
{   1   5 } Furey     Machine Dreams
{ 250 300 } Jerrik    Serpent River & Plain
{   5  20 } Alfa      Holy Grove
{  50  85 } Zurix     Urhagen's Kingdom
{  15  25 } Dylan     Dylan's Area
{ 200 225 } Zurix     Planes of ####
{   5  30 } Raff      Elemental Canyon
{  50  85 } Zurix     Southern Crevass
{  20  45 } Doctor    Galaxy
{  85 135 } Zurix     Zypheriax
{   5  35 } PinkF     Mob Factory
{ 190 210 } Jerrik    Mal'endar Forest
{   5  25 } Sandman   Dragon Cult
{         }
{  15  50 } Glop      Yggdrasil
{  80 100 } Pyros     Heaven
{   5  45 } Strahd    Crystalmir Lake
{ 140 250 } Theodryck Bloodrock City
{   5  35 } Strahd    Town of Solace
{         } Acheron   Realm of Lost Hope
{ 100 200 } Strahd    Descent to ####
{ 100 175 } Silvanos  The Seventh Order
{   5  50 } Draiden   Castle Naytil[/quote]

By my estimate, your world is approximately 90% stock.

There are very few muds that could truthfully refer to themselves as "one of the most unique and original games around".  And your mud is certainly not one of them.

[John]

Originally Posted by (less than sacred @ Aug. 16 2003,19:19) Sure, Midgaard comes with all merc/envy muds but you forgot to let us see the changes, new mobs, new colors, new items, new quest, etc etc.

oooh. New colours So let's go by your "everything BUT newbie village descriptions is original" claim. Why? Why on earth did you make everything EXCEPT the first 5mins original? Why couldn't you spare a little bit more time with the newbie area and make the descriptions original, because frankly, that's what will attract new players.

Sure your level 125 area may be 100% original, but if I see your level 1 area isn't original, I'm not gunna stick around on the promise that EVENTUALLY I'll be able to see an original area.

Originally Posted by Of course all the kiss-asses will fall in line right behind. But that's them, not me. I apologized once and I wasn't even in the wrong.

for the record I'd hardly call me an ass-kisser. I hardly ever come here but this thread was just too funny And you were in the wrong. You made 2 posts within 2 hours of each other with a third post (depending on your time zones) on the same day. He said you made 3 posts in the same day, you said you didn't. You did. You were wrong.

Originally Posted by But never again.

You have 1 bad thread and you automatically say NEVER again? Sheeeesh. Talk about an over-reaction.

BTW, I SKIMMED your area list (and I don't know too much about stock so even with my limited knowledge I still noticed more then 1 stock area). The un-original areas I noticed were:
* Smurf Village
* Yggdrasil
* Orc Caves
* Limbo
* Midgaard
* Descent to Heck

With literally 100s of muds, with these stock areas I'm going to take one glance before leaving. You may have completely reworked the SCRIPTS, but if the descriptions are stock I'm outer there.

Just some friendly advice

[Delerak]

Hahahaha.

-Delerak

[Amnon]

The most important thing you have to remember from this whole thread is that everybody has bad threads... I doubt there's one person on ANY forum that didn't feel like everyone were laughing at him at one time or another.

But the trick is not to argue about it, just accept what they tell you and learn from your mistakes. If you do, nobody will hold a grudge against this thread in the future (I hope? :\ ).

[Dulan]

Oh yes.

Amnon can personally attest to that, isn't that right Amnon? -cough-TMC-cough-

Heheheh .

By Eris, this whole thread is an annoying waste of of bandwidth, storage space, CPU cycles and most importantly, time.

I thought we had moderators to stop stuff like this from going on and on and on and on...?

[less than sacred]

You take a 1969 stock Chevy Camaro, remove the engine and replace it with a 350 four bolt main, wiseco pistons, holly four barrel carb, 3-speed eightball shifter, new tires, and a new paint job is it still stock? It's the same car right?

Obviously it's *not* stock. Much time and effort went into making something good into something better. Just because the names are the same it doesn't mean it's stock.

Scmming things on the surface rarely produces any meaningful information, as people here have so helpfully shown. Dark Hope MUD isn't a good mud. It's a GREAT MUD with many unique features.

Morons will post here claiming to visit Dark Hope for about 12 seconds in order to present "proof" of their claims. The problem is that anyone can tell a slanted story, even one as absurd as the ones posted on this thread.

What they call stock I call familiarity. It's easier to learn the ropes of a new mud if your at least familiar with how some of it works. .
But apparantly that gets lost on some folks when ignorance takes hold. Dark Hope is set in such a way that as you advance more changes are visible.

Hate me, but don't make statements about my mud when you haven't played it long enough to appreciate just how different it is.

[KaVir]

Originally Posted by Scmming things on the surface rarely produces any meaningful information

However it is more than sufficient to reveal that your mud is not "one of the most unique and original games around", as you originally claimed. Indeed, I found it a struggle to find any original features at all, and those I could find didn't seem to work properly.

Originally Posted by It's easier to learn the ropes of a new mud if your at least familiar with how some of it works.

Is that why your world is around 90% stock?

[less than sacred]

Originally Posted by However it is more than sufficient to reveal that your mud is not "one of the most unique and original games around", as you originally claimed. Indeed, I found it a struggle to find any original features at all, and those I could find didn't seem to work properly.

Now Kavir, do you honeslty need to resort to lying again?

Yeah, 90% stock. I guess your definition of stock means having everything changed from the original and redoing everything. In that case, yeah my mud is stock.
Keep talking, Kavir. You're only making yourself look more like an ass and helping make my mud more popular.

You must enjoy being wrong, because you're damned sure good at it.

PROVE to the world that my ENTIRE mud is 90% stock
You can't. No one can. But the more you let your fingers think before your brain does I get more players. So go ahead...keep talking.

[Terloch]

LTS,

First off, being beligerent will get you nowhere but under a massive pile of flaming dung here.

Secondly, you can have the greatest MUD in the world, but if it APPEARS at first glance (which is all most people give something) to be nothing special, you have already lost a majority of the battle.

Take some time, change the initial experience that someone has upon logging in. You are biased towards your own creation (like most of us are) and you will not see things like someone who is brand new to logging on will see, such as Midgaard, stock areas (even if by name), and the APPEARANCE of things being stock, even if they are not.

- Terl

[KaVir]

Originally Posted by Now Kavir, do you honeslty need to resort to lying again?

I have been posting to TMS for many years, and have never lied. You, however, are just another wannabe mud owner who has already proven himself to be a liar (eg claiming that you didn't post three times on the same day, when everyone reading this can see for themselves that you did exactly that). So who, then, do you think is more likely to be taken seriously?

Originally Posted by PROVE to the world that my ENTIRE mud is 90% stock

Why should I need to, when what I in fact stated was "your world is around 90% stock"? By the way, why do you have "Mega-City One" listed as being written by Saza, when it is in fact a stock area written by Glop? You also seem to have two copies of "Ofcol" by Alfa, two copies of "Desert" by Jerrik, etc. Tell me, does "A rich detailed world with many original areas" to you mean a world which is mostly stock, with duplicated areas and stock areas with the credits stripped out?

[Azhon]

This thread's giving the mud's owner lots of free publicity, I wonder if that was truly accidental...

[CSmith_Fan]

Originally Posted by (less than sacred @ Aug. 23 2003,23:48) You take a 1969 stock Chevy Camaro, remove the engine and replace it with a 350 four bolt main, wiseco pistons, holly four barrel carb, 3-speed eightball shifter, new tires, and a new paint job is it still stock?  It's the same car right?

Well, actually what you did was peel off the Camero logo, slap on a Thunderbird logo with SS markings and claim you've got an orginal car that you built from scratch.

First..I'd like to simply say, IMHO, there are no 100% 'unique' or 'orginal' MUDs..there's always some slight element that relates to another MUD or concept somewhere, BUT many come darn close. (yes..I get picky..woe betide those MUDs that say "most realistic" because I've gotten nuked a few times for telling a player in private <with an Immy snooping> the basic PROVEN history of weapons and how the average dirt eating peasant couldnt afford a sword and why a scythe should be available to level 0 chars..how else will my RP enforced famer's kid reap the wheat field? Oh yea..with the 2 handed broadsword for 1 silver Duh..what was I thinking? )

  Sadly, your MUD doesnt come that close. Even if you had 50% stock areas it's wouldnt be 'orginal'. There are some MUDs out there that are orginal. Granted the code might be a derivitive of another code, but the rooms, mobs, items, etc arent in them and thus they can be called 'orginal'.  As for unqiue, unless your MUD it's a 'one of a kind' it isnt.

"Age of Infinity"? I thought your MUD was Dark Hope?  You call your MUD orginal yet use another MUD's logon screen and dont even have the decency to change the names on it? Even the people who deliberatly rip-off another MUD's code and zones at least get the orginal MUD's name out of their MUD. Simply, you tried (and failed) to promote a MUD that probably didnt take that long to put together since 90% of it was already written (and all you had to do was import them..like that's hard to do. My dog can import files)

Granted I will give you a plus...you did go out and activly promote 'your' MUD and some staffers at some MUDs dont even do that. Just get some good builders, let them do what they do best, jank out the stock and put in orginal zones and mobs and items, etc.

Is it really that hard to do?