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This is a discussion on "MUD Reviews" in the Top Mud Sites Bugs and Suggestions forum : I only read the first post. Infringement on your consumer rights huh? What rights exactly would this website be infringing upon? I really hope you're kidding. I mean really. You have no "consumer rights" here. Sorry, I can't add anything else, because I just couldn't get past that.... |
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#31 |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: New England
Posts: 598
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Re: MUD Reviews
I only read the first post. Infringement on your consumer rights huh? What rights exactly would this website be infringing upon?
I really hope you're kidding. I mean really. You have no "consumer rights" here. Sorry, I can't add anything else, because I just couldn't get past that. |
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#32 |
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New Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 26
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Re: MUD Reviews
I assume the game-mechanic you are making a reffrence too is playerbonus.
Timed, player issused roleplay bonus's and a pittance of XP offered on introduction. Given that each bonus is less than a 1/10 of the requirement for each level, They don't provide a nessceary alternative to borging. A fact that your playerbase has raised time and time again and you've been unable to address. Now it isn't an easy issue to address, However You can't then claim that forcing charcters to borg through 10 levels of play before they achieve a real goal which will induct them into real roleplay and also put them in a posistion to actually aqquire those for-mentioned bonus's is a means of deteriant and a barrier of entry. Because your guilded merely end up consisting of borgers and those roleplay fanatics who exsist soley of bonuses are still ideling in there guilds of entrance in order to aqquire there time based bonus. Because players don't bonus people, If they can't get a bonus back. Perhaps not how the systems designed or intended to be used. But its seen and heard to be the case. Immigrants don't get Booned. Moreso, Bonus's are so few and far between with players only giving them to there friends and inner-circle for 'humorous' roleplay. That immigrants and Serfs rarely see them. So, I did play the game plenty, I did roleplay just fine and more so, because of this. I know Borging is the quickest way to get yourself into a posistion in which you're taking seriously and not looked upon as just another newbie-twink who needs his hand-holding. Charcter-forming in the sense of peer recgonition only takes place after guildhooding. |
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#33 | ||
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Name: NewWorlds
Home MUD: New Worlds
Posts: 365
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Re: MUD Reviews
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There will always be those that attack other or competing muds in this fashion, which I find sad. |
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#34 | |
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New Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 26
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Re: MUD Reviews
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Your disagreement dosen't really concern me. More so, I was forced to chuckle at the fact that because I'm a peer in the sense that I'm involved in the development and construction of muds. My opinons held in less-regard than a player. Alas... My post wasn't a rant but an analytical breakdown and explination of why, Borging+time != Roleplay. ![]() |
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#35 | |
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New Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Home MUD: Carrion Fields
Posts: 18
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Re: MUD Reviews
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To stay on topic, I think that commentable reviews are a good thing. Personally, I think that this discussion about New Worlds that has taken place in this thread is a good example of how such commentable review should work. From the discussion, people can get some idea what the game is about and whether it is good game for them to try. If they have open questions, they can post them in the review thread for the game admin or players to answer. Personally, I think that the games getting this kind of attention would certainly benefit from it as their target group of players could find the game based on it. |
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#36 | ||
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Name: NewWorlds
Home MUD: New Worlds
Posts: 365
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Re: MUD Reviews
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I will say, however, that the ability to join any group or become anything is very wide road and open even to the lowest level, non-guilded player. I've seen immigrants wield more social power than guild masters, when roleplayed properly and effectively. Quote:
Still, the trouble with the fellow that complained about having to kill for coins is that it seems old and out of touch. I'd venture to say this person hasn't been on NW in a year or more and likely isn't an rp buff as stated by the "I'll go borg, this is the way to do it" attitude. One forgets that anyone can press for levels or advancement and make it to a high power player only to find out that they forgot to roleplay along the way and gain support and now sit at the top alone without an ounce of social or political strength. |
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#37 |
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Moderator
Join Date: Apr 2002
Home MUD: Carrion Fields
Posts: 634
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Re: MUD Reviews
Given that this is a thread about TMS's review feature on the "Bugs and Suggestions" board, you're getting pretty far off-topic. The fine details of NW's mechanics aren't terribly relevant to that discussion. Please take it to PMs.
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#38 |
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New Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Home MUD: Carrion Fields
Posts: 18
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Re: MUD Reviews
I've thought about this a little bit and came up with following idea:
Make two forum sections for reviews. One for reviews themselves, which would allow anonymous posting of non-registered users but would be also moderated in a sense that the posts don't show before a moderator has reviewed and approved all of them. This would allow reviews compactly in one place and without clutter, and from players since they don't have to register to post a review. This subsection would not allow discussing or commenting the reviews. One thread per MUD, would pile the reviews nicely in one place. The other forum section would be for discussion about reviews, where admins and players who have registered to the forums can discuss the reviews and ask questions that arise from them. This subsection wouldn't have reviews themselves, but rather, the commentary and discussion based on the reviews on the review board. You could also discuss features of a certain MUD, mostly in light of reviews. |
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#39 | |
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Administrator
Join Date: May 2005
Name: Derek
Location: Orlando
Posts: 237
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Re: MUD Reviews
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The reviews get linked to much more than forum posts. I've even seen quite a few links to TMC and TMS reviews as "external references" on Wikipedia listings for MUDs. There could be a link under each review saying "Click here to read comments on this review", but if we're going to do that then again, they might as well just be there. |
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#40 |
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Member
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 142
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Re: MUD Reviews
I think the only problem with the reviews at this site is that they don't get pre-screened, people just post whatever, and that's bad.
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#41 |
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Senior Member
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Re: MUD Reviews
So what's happening with player reviews? It's kinda wasted space if we aren't using them.
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#42 |
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Member
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 142
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Re: MUD Reviews
Well I guess I didn't post any suggestions here did I.
First of all they might as well be called "comments" not reviews. They need to be linked from the mud's listing i.e. "read comments about this mud", in threaded forum post style layout so easy to just read through the author's comments and only read followups if that comment was a juicy one. I'm thinking of the way pages are displayed over at php.net, with comments that give you more information about the game. We have vote buttons for rating muds...right.. we dont really need reviews too for that. If you want to find the most popular rp/pk muds, you can just do a search. * But commentary would still be handy for both players and staff. Speaking of voting, a new review/comment should not bump the mud name onto the front page without moderation -that leads to people posting them for the sake of it. I'm serious, go look at them. "AWESOME MUD!!!!!" etc. It should only be there if its worth reading for someone looking for a mud. Oh, I guess I already said that. * search should display the highest voted muds first if it doesnt, in order for me to have a valid point |
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#43 | ||||
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Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Europe
Posts: 30
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Re: MUD Reviews
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I refer you to the evil comment they didnt like Quote:
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All said and done, if someone want to review a MUD, the can always add it as a new computer game to CIAO or DOOYOO the consumer review sites. Just would be nice to see them here at the site which actually points us to them. |
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#44 | |
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Legend
Join Date: Apr 2002
Name: Richard
Location: München
Home MUD: God Wars II
Posts: 1,509
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Re: MUD Reviews
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When you choose to write a review, it opens up a special page which contains several text boxes - for example it might include sections such as "introduction", "atmosphere", "gameplay", "good points", "bad points", "summary", etc. You'd have to fill in every section, and then submit it under a registered username. Perhaps these reviews could even be moderated to a certain extent (either by the mud owner, TMS moderators, or by regular TMS members via an Amazon style "Do you find this review useful Y/N" - depending on what the reviews are supposed to represent). In particular, I think the separate text boxes would provide a good way of forcing reviewers to format their reviews in a consistent way and cover the different aspects of the mud, while requiring people to cover both good points and bad points should encourage them to write more balanced reviews than most of the current ones. You could also a "Reviews: #" which is displayed under "Posts: #", with the option to view all reviews by a particular poster. It might also be nice to tie this in with a reputation system (probably not the current one, or mud critics would soon end up with really bad reputations), and factor it into the reviews; once again I'm thinking of something along the lines of Amazon's "Top 100 reviewers". In addition you could just choose to write a comment, which would work much like the current reviews, except in a forum style so that other people could respond. |
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#45 |
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Member
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 142
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Re: MUD Reviews
Well if it absolutely has to be reviews too then..
5 fields- longevity (rate from 1-5) gameplay 1-5 appeal 1-5 community 1-5 overall 1-5 final field for comments Then just bung their average category ratings over the top of their comments, and individual comments. Like ratemyprofessor.com that's a great peer review site. |
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#46 |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: New England
Posts: 598
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Re: MUD Reviews
Yes in a perfect world where love-cakes grow on trees and the rain only falls just after you've left the grove and the fairies give you magic dust that doesn't cause a deviated septum when you snort it...
mud reviews will be fair and worth reading and actually contributory to a website such as this one. Unfortunately, there are these really pesky little creatures called trolls and gnats and griefers, who for vile and evil intent (I love how vile and evil are comprised of the same four letters as live, don't you?) will post reviews that aren't reviews in the reviews section. I can't tell you how many times I've taken a gander to the reviews section and seen something like this: This game is teh awesomesauce on lollerskatez! It has 20 clans!!!!!!11111 and 400 races!!!!!!!!1111 You need to play it it's freeeeeeeeeeee!!!!111111oneoneoneleven!!!1 and this: This game is teh sux0rz teh imms ban j00 4 ne reason or no reason play my mud instead its teh awesomesauce!!!1111 and this: I did not ban u 4 ne reason or no reason i ban j00 4 u are teh sux0rz and j00 ch33t and hack mah server!!!111 oh and I especially like these: Hey I just found this place, glad to be here! You might find -this- site interesting too: viagra.biggerisbetter.com It's because of any and all of the above that some folks prefer to just not allow reviews on their games, because there is no way to prevent players (and even game admins) from posting ads for the game instead of a review (apparently the vast majority of people who write these things don't know the difference between an ad and a review), or griefers posting JUST to tell everyone about how they were completely innocent, doing nothing wrong, and admin pwiped their account, or spammers on a rampage with viagra ads. The reviews section on this website reads more like the back pages of a fashion magazine (special offer, free trial just circle #13 on your mail-in card now and SEND!) than actual reviews. I don't blame any admin for not wanting -their- game to be represented in such a way. If Lasher ever decides to do something about that, maybe something like how Mudconnector does it, perhaps there will no longer be a need to reject reviews. But without any moderation or approval system of reviews then the mud admins need to retain the option of simply not allowing THEIR muds to be dragged through the OTHER kind of mud. |
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#47 | |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Sweden
Home MUD: 4 Dimensions
Posts: 472
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Re: MUD Reviews
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If so, could you please provide us with some links, so we can have some more laughs? Your 'review' examples are certainly entertaining, but do they really exist? I can't recall ever seeing anything nearly as sub-par as those. And as far as I've heard, spam adverts get nuked pretty quickly too. In fact, I cannot even recall ever coming across a player who talked like that, but maybe I just play the wrong games? Sure, the reviews here are usually no literary high-points, and sure, many of them are just fan-boy praise or disgruntled-player flames, but is it really necessary to paint things out as worse than they are? |
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