[the_logos]

I'm pleased to announce that Iron Realms has hired Chad McHenry, known as Traithe here, as producer for our next text MUD, based on the work of Raymond E. Feist. Until his hiring, Chad was the head admin and driving force behind Shadows of Isildur, a popular roleplaying-focused MUD.

Welcome aboard Chad!

--matt

[Burr]

WHOOHOO!!!

I think I'm going to cry. It's such a wonderful thing to hear. This union is a big score for the mud community. Not that Feist was one of my favorite authors but at least he's prolific enough to provide a lot of material. I'm sure the mud will be develop its own style and story, and be all the better for who is leading its creation.

[Brody]

I second that. Traithe is going to do a fantastic job with this project. I wish him luck, although I don't think he'll need it.

[Hephos]

Hehe gratz traithe!

[Bluewolf]

We'll certainly miss him. You guys are getting one heck of a guy.

[Traithe]

Thanks for the well-wishes folks, they're always nice to hear, especially from people I've come to respect here (and especially when I'm trying to convince myself I'm ready to handle this beast! ). Hope I can live up to your expectations!

[Jenred]

Originally Posted by Until his hiring, Chad was the head admin and driving force behind Shadows of Isildur

Is this to say he will not be working on Shadows of Isildur as a driving force in the future?

[the_logos]

Originally Posted by (Jenred @ Jan. 18 2005,01:13) Originally Posted by Until his hiring, Chad was the head admin and driving force behind Shadows of Isildur Is this to say he will not be working on Shadows of Isildur as a driving force in the future?

Put it this way: The project we've hired him for will be the newest MUD from Iron Realms. Our expectations are high and there's only 24 hours in a day, or about 4 less than he'll need to get ready for a 2006 release. So...

--matt
P.S. Chad: Our investors include the Grand Poobah of Evil and part of the contract we had to sign was that SOMEBODY'S soul gets consigned to everlasting torment in the Pit of Horrific, Horrifying, Horrible Pain if we fail. You're the new guy....but hey, no pressure!

[Traithe]

Sorry man, but your Poobah ain't got nothin' on my civil procedure professor.

<pauses, considering the possibility that their Poobah might BE his civil procedure professor>

Er... is is too late to back out?

[Hephos]

Hey, you gotta update your signature now

[Jenred]

Ah, thats unfortunate. Its sad to see people sell out, especially what seemed like good people.

Good luck to you.

[Sanvean]

Traithe's a great pick, a good and thoughtful mud admin. Congratulatins, Traithe, and good luck in your new endeavor! I hope Shadows of Isildur will be able to manage without your driving presence.

[the_logos]

1-->

Originally Posted by (Jenred @ Jan. 18 2005,12[img http://www.topmudsites.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif[/img]1)]Ah, thats unfortunate. Its sad to see people sell out, especially what seemed like good people. Good luck to you.

If by sell out you mean "move from a hobbyist to a paid professional" then sure, it's selling out, though that's like saying that a kid who learns to code as a teenager, goes to college for a degree in computer science, and then gets a job coding has "sold out", or that a writer who manages to publish a book as opposed to just giving it to his friends has "sold out."

The very concept of "selling out" as a pejorative is kind of a juvenile notion. I know I'm awfully glad my dad "sold out" and was able to, say, feed me when I was younger. I'm sure the kids of some of our partners and employees are very glad their parents "sold out."

I don't know your personal situation, of course, but unless you plan to leech off someone else's hard work your entire life, you best be prepared to "sell out" as well. Of course, the more rational way to look at it is, "Check it out! I can do something I love for a living! This is fantastic!"

--matt

[Arval]

the_logos,
I've never really enjoyed any of your games. Thats not to say they are bad, thats just saying they aren't my style. With Traithe now working behind the curtain on your upcoming MUD, I may just have to give it a try. You have hired not only a great coder, but a great person.

Traithe,
Congrats. We never did speak much on SoI since I left for the military, but you helped me when you could, and I appreciate it. Shadows of Isildur is a great game. I still smile when I see some of the unique things, and say, "I helped come up with that idea!"

You are an amazing coder. What you have done from Harshlands to SoI is nothing short of extrordinary. I am a bit sad to see you go, but we all knew the time was coming. You have some times ahead of you, with the hire-on by Iron Realms, and as you finish law school. I hope you will stop by from time to time. If you are ever bored, shoot me an email, let me know how things are going.
----------------------------------------------------------------------


I for one, do not think Traithe sold out. He was hired. The community should be happy for him. In life, things change. For now, I'm just going to keep promoting my favorite MUD...

----------------------------
Shadows of Isildur MUD
www.middle-earth.us
----------------------------

Keep well Traithe.

Reguards,
Alan M. Koziol
One of the first

[the_logos]

Originally Posted by (Arval @ Jan. 18 2005,13:15) the_logos, I've never really enjoyed any of your games. Thats not to say they are bad, thats just saying they aren't my style. With Traithe now working behind the curtain on your upcoming MUD, I may just have to give it a try. You have hired not only a great coder, but a great person.

I like to think we're getting someone with more than 'just' a coder's skillset too. I have confidence in his abilities as a designer and leader as well, which are skillsets equally as important as coding for what he's going to be doing.

[dragon master]

How RP oriented is this new mud going to be? Anywhere close to SoI?

[the_logos]

Originally Posted by (dragon master @ Jan. 18 2005,16:21) How RP oriented is this new mud going to be? Anywhere close to SoI?

Well, little to nothing has been decided about the game at this point, but it will definitely not be roleplaying required. Roleplaying required games are, with all due respect to those who enjoy them, not popular enough.

--matt

[Jenred]

Originally Posted by If by sell out you mean "move from a hobbyist to a paid professional" then sure, it's selling out, though that's like saying that a kid who learns to code as a teenager, goes to college for a degree in computer science, and then gets a job coding has "sold out", or that a writer who manages to publish a book as opposed to just giving it to his friends has "sold out."

A hobby is an activity or interest pursued outside one's regular occupation and engaged in primarily for pleasure. When your paid for your hobby it becomes your regular occupation.

Iron Realms Entertainment, from the information available on their site, and from general implications from their actions as a company thus far have not been to create products that people enjoy. Its been to create products enjoyable ENOUGH to have people pay for them, and to churn out many to cover many genres and thus get the most amount of people to pay for them as possible. Its stated that the company approaches game creation on a business model.

Unless my perception of Traithe was incorrect, I believed him to be someone who was not in it for the money, but rather creating an enjoyable product that everyone could enjoy equally. (Free, with no gimmicks attached). Iron Realms creates products where the advancement of your character is tied to how much of your real money you put into it. It would be entirely different if they were upfront, pay-to-play across the board.

Originally Posted by The very concept of "selling out" as a pejorative is kind of a juvenile notion. I know I'm awfully glad my dad "sold out" and was able to, say, feed me when I was younger. I'm sure the kids of some of our partners and employees are very glad their parents "sold out."

Money is not everything, I'm afraid. I'd much rather do something I enjoy, for free then, as I said, 'sell out', and make it my perogative to work money out of people.

You entire 'business model approach' to gaming and game-design is really divisive to what has always been a for the players, by the players type of community. All the original code-bases were designed with free-use as a paramount objective in the long-run.

Originally Posted by I don't know your personal situation, of course, but unless you plan to leech off someone else's hard work your entire life, you best be prepared to "sell out" as well. Of course, the more rational way to look at it is, "Check it out! I can do something I love for a living! This is fantastic!"

If I love killing people, and made a living doing it, someone would object likely. Personal gratification isn't always foremost. And I'm saddened that people would abandon their hobbies for corporate pittance.


Anyways, good for you I guess.

[Traithe]

Jeez. I've always tried on a personal level to give folks the benefit of the doubt, but let me tell you, with some of the reactions I've gotten to this news over the past couple days in some cases it's become increasingly hard to do so.

I just wanted to say thanks again to everyone who's wished me well over the past few days! I always feel a little awkward responding to posts like this so this will be the last time I do so, but after all the emails, posts and PMs wishing me well I felt a little obligated. So, thanks very much.

As for folks like Jenred, well, everyone's entitled to their opinions - even when they're ignorant and wrong. I suppose all I'll say is that I'm continually amazed at how childish and judgmental people can be on occasion - and heck, I spend a large portion of my schoolday reading about hate crimes and other such nastiness.

And for those who are interested, SoI will be quite fine. In fact, I imagine that it will continue to thrive, and three years from now I'll pop in and not even recognize the place. I've more or less been preparing for this for over a year now (stepping down for personal reasons, though not necessarily taking on another job), and so we've got two very excellent and capable people who will be taking the reins and replacing me. I suppose the fact that it takes two very fine people working in tandem to do the job I've been doing for the past few years, in addition to being a full-time graduate student and a part-time worker, speaks volumes as to one of the reasons I thought it was time for a change!

Anyhow. Thanks again and take care folks, I'll be lurking as always. <g>

[Angie]

Congratulations, Traithe, and good luck.

[Azhon]

Erm, what happened to Matt's concerns about SoT's IP?

http://www.topmudsites.com/cgi-bin....shadows

It is a big big thread and I'm not sure what happened. What happened? It's odd that after posting something like that he hires its creator.

[John]

Originally Posted by (the_logos @ Jan. 18 2005,12:59) If by sell out

Gah. You really need to stop responding to every bit of flame-bait that comes your way. That's why all your threads degenerate into flames. While it does keep your threads active which helps keep your games in people's minds, you really should think about the quality of the "advertising."

Just something to think about.

Oh, and congrats Traithe I hope you get everything you wanted out of your new role. I hope the stigma that surrounds IR for some doesn't make you regret your decision.

Originally Posted by (the_logos @ Jan. 18 2005,16:36) Roleplaying required games are, with all due respect to those who enjoy them, not popular enough.

That's true. With true roleplaying games (as opposed to console RPGs) being a niche market that makes sense. Muds are a niche market as it is. To get as much money as possible (or even to just make any profit after paying your employees and expanses, not even including saving money for times when you'll be paying employees for working on games that won't get any income for 12 months) you can't limit yourself even further.

[Estarra]

I'm not sure why anyone would think that a producer of an Iron Realms game is focused on trying to "work money out of people" (whatever that means). Rather, being one of the evil overlords of IRE, I can say my first and foremost focus is to design a game that players enjoy, which brings me immense personal satisfaction. Certainly, if this were a hobby, I couldn't devote the time into the game as I do otherwise.

Anyway, welcome to the team, Traithe! If you enjoy your job half as much as I enjoy mine, you'll be living on Cloud 9!

[the_logos]

Originally Posted by Gah. You really need to stop responding to every bit of flame-bait that comes your way. That's why all your threads degenerate into flames. While it does keep your threads active which helps keep your games in people's minds, you really should think about the quality of the "advertising."

Shrug, they degenerate into flames because people start flaming me. That's their issue to deal with. I also appreciate the advice on marketing, but I'm confident in our ability to market effectively within the text MUD market. I think our results bear out that confidence.

Originally Posted by I hope the stigma that surrounds IR for some doesn't make you regret your decision.

Heh heh. I know I cry tears of shame that some raving loonies object to whatever they object to. That kind of opinion would only matter if it was held by people with any kind of influence. IRE enjoys a good reputation with people we have to give a hoot about, like our customers or the people whose livelihoods depend on us or the larger games industry, or the media. A few bitter forum posters are irrelevant in the larger scope, though they are fun to play with sometimes.

--matt

[Angie]

Originally Posted by (Azhon @ Jan. 19 2005,03:00) Erm, what happened to Matt's concerns about SoT's IP? http://www.topmudsites.com/cgi-bin....shadows It is a big big thread and I'm not sure what happened. What happened? It's odd that after posting something like that he hires its creator.

The issues have been resolved between SoI and Tolkien Enterprises earlier this year. I'm sure you can find the posts about it somewhere around here.

[the_logos]

Originally Posted by Jenred,Jan. 18 2005,18[img http://www.topmudsites.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif[/img]2]

Originally Posted by Iron Realms Entertainment, from the information available on their site, and from general implications from their actions as a company thus far have not been to create products that people enjoy.

Oh my god, you're right! Nobody enjoys our games! *panic* Clearly we've invented a new business model where we have to pay people to play. Seems we're paying about 800 people to play right now. Or perhaps you believe we've invented mind control. Yes! That's it! Mind control.

Originally Posted by and to churn out many to cover many genres

Wow, you're a genius! Let's see, Achaea is fantasy. Aetolia is fantasy. Imperian is fantasy. Lusternia is fantasy. Hmm, I must be stupid. I guess I'm missing the other genres.  Oh, incidentally, the game Traithe was hired for? Also fantasy.

Originally Posted by Iron Realms creates products where the advancement of your character is tied to how much of your real money you put into it.

Wow! Again, pure brilliance. Although I guess I have to wonder at your logic, given that it's not possible to buy advancement in our games, and that many players never spend a dime. Likely your mind is just too subtle for me though.

Originally Posted by Money is not everything, I'm afraid. I'd much rather do something I enjoy, for free then, as I said, 'sell out', and make it my perogative to work money out of people.

Man, you're on a roll. I can only marvel at the sheer magnitude of your intellect. Taking a job doing something you don't love to do is definitely the way to a happy life. Good thinking!

Originally Posted by You entire 'business model approach' to gaming and game-design is really divisive to  what has always been a for the players, by the players type of community. All the original code-bases were designed with free-use as a paramount objective in the long-run.

And? All the original MUDs started commercial or went commercial. The MUDs that entertain the most people have -always- been commercial. Do you see me whining that the free codebases have 'betrayed' the original spirit of MUDs? Of course not, because that would be a ridiculous thing to complain about. It's called 'diversity' and it's a good thing.

Originally Posted by [If I love killing people, and made a living doing it, someone would object likely.

I'd object whether you did it as a hobby or for a living.

Originally Posted by And I'm saddened that people would abandon their hobbies for corporate pittance.

Yeah, man, I'm always so saddened when any of my writer friends manage to get something published for money. SO sad. I always think, "You poor sell-outs, how dare you try to make a living doing something you love." You really are a genius.


--matt
P.S. Just to make sure you get it, I was being sarcastic in much of this post. Traithe said it nice and bluntly though: Ignorant and childish.

[Jenred]

I've said my piece and stand by it.

[Nix]

I've said it elsewhere and I'll say it again here:

Congratulations, Traithe.

You're very lucky to be able to do what you love for a living, and IRE has gained themselves an extremely talented dynamo.

[Threshold]

Congratulations Traithe and Matt!

Best of luck to you and the exciting new game.

[John]

Originally Posted by (the_logos @ Jan. 18 2005,20:48) I also appreciate the advice on marketing, but I'm confident in our ability to market effectively within the text MUD market. I think our results bear out that confidence.

Yeah I couldn't think of a way to say I doubt the flames help advertising without sounding all pompous and cocky Although I do question the amount of traffic you get because people read the flames and think "I'm gunna check out this game" and then proceed to give the mud money. Heck, I also question how many people visit your game and give you money because of it being in the recent discussions on the main page

And if that isn't reason enough, perhaps trying to help make this forum a better place is a good reason to stop responding to every bit of flame-bait (just halve the amount of flame-bait you respond to and it would be an improvement ). No, not saying it's your fault. But you do help encourage it. I also like coming to this forum despite the flames. There are a few nuggets of gold here, occassionally.

Originally Posted by (Angie @ Jan. 18 2005,21:12) The issues have been resolved between SoI and Tolkien Enterprises earlier this year. I'm sure you can find the posts about it somewhere around here.

Really? Wow. Congratulations. I'm amazed you were able to contact somebody and get them to give you permission (Although I doubt they ever cared, I'm just amazed you managed to get permission instead of being ignored).