[Silver Phoenix]

Hi.
I'm looking for a new MUD to play. The most important feature for me is being able to group with other players to kill NPCs and do quests together. I'm looking for a MUD that has highly advanced group system.

And I don't mean a MUD where grouping is "encouraged" (I've seen a lot of MUDs where grouping is encouraged just by placing high level NPCs with nice equipment drops) but rather the whole focus of the MUD should preferably be grouping starting from early levels (important! - I'm impatient with muds that fail to deliver satisfaction fast). By that I mean features such as:

• plenty of skills that help other party members directly rather then just yourself (examples: skill for melee fighters to protect casters from damage, a spell that transfers hit points from one player to another, spells that effect whole room, a skill to hold down an enemy disabling both enemy and whoever holds him, spell to levitate a groupmate so he can hit a really tall enemy in the head during which caster cannot do anything else because the spell requires concentration, etc)
• skills for which you need more then one person to perform (examples: spell to share hit points, surround enemies (warriors) for higher chance to hit, ambush (rogues) to get few free hits in the beginning of the battle, a spell such as "triangle of death" for which three mages stand in a triangle around enemies and while none of them gets hit enemies inside take continuous damage, etc) or skills that work better when two people do them at the same time (hold enemy down, confuse spell, etc)
• Battle formations
• Advanced strategies required for certain situations such as if an otherwise weak enemy flees all the time there should be skills to hold him down or to block exit; a caster has a spell such as burning hands for which he needs to be in front lines and therefore take damage so to preform such feat he casts "share damage" on a warrior so that warrior takes some of the damage that caster gets (considering casters low hit points) then when he is low on mana (or health) a warrior takes over tanking
• quests that require certain number of people
• other activities that require certain number of people, such as sailing a ship (one person steers, others control sails, others fire cannons in battle)

Other requirement is that the game should be free and no pay-for-perks (so IRE games are out of question)

Other than that I don't mind other features. Pk is ok, but I'd prefer if the game was focused on exping and questing (and skills are designed to deal with NPCs rather then PCs). I can deal with RP and non-RP enviroment as long as I will not get limited by people I can group with due to roleplay reasons. I somewhat dislike player run goverments because those take away time from questing and wars force pk.

Other features that would be nice are:

• Advanced combat system (such as body part targetting - being able to lose limbs would be awesome as long as there are ways to restore them easily after battle (no need to go back to town), before you die you lose conciousness and other players can save you, etc)
• good newbie help files/tutorial/PC halpers (but as I said grouping is the best way to learn ropes),
• nice colors
• most equipment should be plain shop stock equipment but a player should be able to find some high quality or "magic" equipment even at low levels by killing certain NPC's, questing, etc
• being able to abreviate commands, people's names and/or objects (such as instead of typing 'ask Questmaster about dragon' you type 'a que dragon'),
• Save equipment on quit (requiring quitting in inns feature is ok as long as you don't lose all your equimpent if you just disconnect - sometimes I just don't have time to get to an inn - there are other ways to punish a player who disconnects)
• Global events such as pirates land nearby and start pillaging a town (you have a choice to hide it out or to help fight agains them, or even get a quest from pirate leader to kill or capture mayor of the town if you prefer to be evil)
• Ability to travel on seas, flying, other dimensions, etc
• Different ways to battle ( such as getting hurt while fighting flying can get you to fall, on seas you control battleships, defensive structures such as walls and trenches need to be overcome or destroyed before you can attack enemies, mounted combat, etc)
• Clans
• Class specific items/quests/locations - but please be fair to all classes
• I just love pets, subordinates, summons, etc - NPCs you can control
• Activities to create variety from exping and questing such as fishing are also fun
• Any other features that improve the game and are unique

Well, I think that is all. I don't know if such MUDs exist and am willing to try whatever is closest. Would be grateful for any suggestions.

Thanks,
Silver Phoenix

[Nodeka]

My suggestion would be to code that MUD yourself.

I'm sure there are muds that fit some of your criteria, however with all that you are looking for, why not do the world a favor and create that mud for everyone

[Newworlds]

Originally Posted by Nodeka My suggestion would be to code that MUD yourself. I'm sure there are muds that fit some of your criteria, however with all that you are looking for, why not do the world a favor and create that mud for everyone

Code shmode, NW has about 85% of what your looking for if I read what your wishlist is correctly. There are some things that are slightly different in technique and functionality, but I suggest you come on by and see for yourself.

Keep in mind NW is a Roleplay enforced game, however this will only add to the environment you seek.

Some main features you are looking for and will find on NW:

* Group oriented - NW is a group adventuring game, having no limit to the number of adventurers you can join and lay waste to the countryside. As many as 30 Adventurers have joined and many times 5 to 15 is not unheard of in long adventures.

* Combat, especially against invasions, caravans, and cargo runs inlude catapults, special weapons, and tactics. with massive army/like battle and intelligent enemy.

* Saved equip on exit no matter where you are.

* Skills, guilds, and clans similar to your request.

* Colors that are appropriate rather than techni-color style

* Ships and fleets, including the ability to combat other ships and board them as well as join merchant cargo ships on runs to other ports.

* Pets and other familiars available like guard dogs or even a dragon (if you can find that that is).

* Fishing: Deep sea of of boats, or at lakes, as well as crabbing in the bay and underwater exploring and clam digging are all part of the game.

* Newbie friendly. Just come and see. We have guides and staff specifically set for new players (we clal immigrants).

* Free to play. Well. NW is the most free you can get. All we require is that you stay in character and roleplay your character appropriately. No registrations, donations, or pay to play, or bonuses for paying since we do not allow any form of payment or donations of any kind.

I'm sure there are numerous other features that fit into your criteria if I was to go into more detail. But I think this gives you a good picture. You will have to play for some time to get a feel for adventuring and joining groups as social and political roleplay are big in this game.

[Silver Phoenix]

I tried the New Worlds like you advised.

Some things I liked:
-the initial tour of the city - really helps you learn
-friendly people
-equipment management - you can use 'sell all swords' command for example
-intro system (including rp bonus)

Things I did not like:
-at death your equipment is not only left behind/dropped on the groud, but gets picked up by whatever killed you (well if this mud is truly group oriented as you say then its not hard to deal with it in a group)
-no way to estimate strength of enemies (no consider command)
-no easy way to find somebody to group with (can't use channels due to rp reasons, and no way to tell other people's levels [and can't really ask sinse it'd be ooc])
-you lose memory when you die (people you greeted) - what's the purpose of that?
-I can kill pretty much anything in the newbie training grounds and there are no leads as to where to go hunt next


Got a few questions:
1. Considering that this is a roleplay mud, is there family option? (can you marry to another adventurer, can you have other adventurers as children or be someone else's child?)
2. Invasions and other tactical battles you spoke of are they computer/admin controlled events or player controlled politics that include pk
3. In order to control a ship do you need to have fulfilled some requirements other then enough money to buy one (such as having a certain rank in the city and have city officials give you one to fight for them). And if you don't have enough money/experience/reputation to control one can you join someone else's ship?

In any case I'll see if I can find somebody to group with and learn a bit more about the world.

[Newworlds]

Originally Posted by Silver Phoenix I tried the New Worlds like you advised. Some things I liked: -the initial tour of the city - really helps you learn -friendly people -equipment management - you can use 'sell all swords' command for example -intro system (including rp bonus)

Some answers for you:

Originally Posted by Silver Phoenix -at death your equipment is not only left behind/dropped on the groud, but gets picked up by whatever killed you (well if this mud is truly group oriented as you say then its not hard to deal with it in a group)

This is natural as an enemy would want the gear it took. And yes, group up kill all.

Originally Posted by Silver Phoenix -no way to estimate strength of enemies (no consider command)

Actually this is possible, but it is not a power everyone has, only some and you'll have to find out IC. But definately not something you will have as an immigrant.

Originally Posted by Silver Phoenix -no easy way to find somebody to group with (can't use channels due to rp reasons, and no way to tell other people's levels [and can't really ask sinse it'd be ooc])

Another thing that will be easier when you join a guild. For now, the best way is to go to the tavern or other populated location and ask around for someone to go adventuring with. Again, this is much easier once you join a guild.

Originally Posted by Silver Phoenix -you lose memory when you die (people you greeted) - what's the purpose of that?

Mostly for the confusion roleplay of death. The other factor is for PK. Memory loss helps in those situations. The last factor is that you get roleplay experience and coins from the introductions and is a roleplay offset of death.

Originally Posted by Silver Phoenix -I can kill pretty much anything in the newbie training grounds and there are no leads as to where to go hunt next

Like all things in NW (which is painful for many not used to our forced roleplay system), most if not everything must be discovered in gameplay. While help files abound for ooc type functionality, areas, monsters, weapons, armours, items of power, etc, must all be found out about in character.

Originally Posted by Silver Phoenix 1. Considering that this is a roleplay mud, is there family option? (can you marry to another adventurer, can you have other adventurers as children or be someone else's child?)

Yes, you can marry with some benifits. Children is a roleplay choice.

Originally Posted by Silver Phoenix 2. Invasions and other tactical battles you spoke of are they computer/admin controlled events or player controlled politics that include pk

Both. Caravans, both land and sea, are player driven as well as tactical adventures. Invasions, however, are staff controlled and follow certain events. Let's hope you are in a guild before you discover the end of an invader's blade.

Originally Posted by Silver Phoenix 3. In order to control a ship do you need to have fulfilled some requirements other then enough money to buy one (such as having a certain rank in the city and have city officials give you one to fight for them). And if you don't have enough money/experience/reputation to control one can you join someone else's ship?

Just the money. And yes you can sail with someone else, if the ship is big enough. (The smallest is a dingy and holds 2 people. The largest can hold up to 15). Find someone on the docks or in the tavern and ask to join them. I know that last night an event was held by a player to go deep sea fishing with Immigrants and Serfs on a 15 crew yacht.

Hopefully this helps you. You can also ask any questions on Immigrant Channel, or ask for a Staff or Guide to meet you in customs (an ooc location) to help you personally. But mostly you will want to make it into a guild for more robust adventure.

[Silver Phoenix]

Let me get this straight, people cannot tell you about different areas (not even location), there is no help on beginner's areas, when you are in a group whoever does not know the area is supposed to lead (which leads to people not wanting to group with you). So all you are left to do is go in random direction from the city and hope that whatever you decide to kill is close to your level, since there is no consider command otherwise you die and lose all your equipment and decrease in skills.


The point of groups should be to learn the game: you follow somebody to an area do some exping and equipping next time you can go to the area alone and see what you can do yourself. I understand purpose of not sharing quest information but this much mystery is just not my thing.


Thank you, but NewWorlds is just not for me

[Newworlds]

Originally Posted by Silver Phoenix Let me get this straight, people cannot tell you about different areas (not even location),

No, people can tell you where things are and will if you ask. Especially if you are new people will tell you to seek out the forests, or farm, or similar areas.

Originally Posted by Silver Phoenix ...there is no help on beginner's areas, when you are in a group whoever does not know the area is supposed to lead (which leads to people not wanting to group with you).

Not hardly. Most people love grouping and having someone lead. It happens all the time, but keep in mind YOU are an Immigrant. It is like hmm, that kid named "Buddy" on The Incredibles, wanting to be Incrediboy and follow Mr. Incredible around. If you don't know the reference, rent the movie, it's a good depiction.

Originally Posted by Silver Phoenix So all you are left to do is go in random direction from the city and hope that whatever you decide to kill is close to your level, since there is no consider command otherwise you die and lose all your equipment and decrease in skills.

The consider command is a crutch that you do not need. Fight something, if you are losing, do what your character would do....RUN! There are few things that you will find that you can't run from without warning.

Originally Posted by Silver Phoenix The point of groups should be to learn the game: you follow somebody to an area do some exping and equipping next time you can go to the area alone and see what you can do yourself. I understand purpose of not sharing quest information but this much mystery is just not my thing.

Nothing wrong with that, the only rule on areas is about quests and traps. Again, you are too low ranked for anyone to bother with making you lead to the areas you can go to. However, like I said before, many will not be gung ho to lead around someone just to help you level, you will need to roleplay a reason for them to be with you. I know you can do it!

Originally Posted by Silver Phoenix Thank you, but NewWorlds is just not for me

Awww, well, there are other games that are more "meta-gamish" that you would like alot more perhaps. We tend to make a player immerse in the world and find out things in character vs. having a manual on all the weapons, areas, armours. While this can be fun (I even love it sometimes) it is not what NW is about. You have to live here, not play here ;-). Thanks for coming by and trying it out!

[bridgette]

Well, I have tried out New Worlds and right after I entered the city, I walked past someone who greeted me, introduced himself and after a bit of chatting even offered to take me on a tour and tell me a few things of the city. I was quite impressed, and must say that it really helped. I will probably go back there very soon. It seemed very interesting.
I like the idea that everything must be in character and that there aren't help files on in-game stuff. I know it makes things harder, but I like it.

[Silver Phoenix]

Well, bridgette, read 'help areas' in game and if you still like it then maybe this mud is for you, but for me personally its too steep of a learning curve ( not newbie friendly past the initial tour of the city)

[Lasher]

This first MUD I ever played had no list of areas at all, you learned about places by talking to others/exporing/dying. The consider was only very basic, you needed a "lore" skill to really see if a monster was much stronger than you. A death took about two weeks of solid playing to recover and eq didn't save. There was no color and only about 10 skills. It's appeal was it was perfectly balanced and being LPC every mob was an adventure in itself. It was still the most fun MUD I've ever played but that's probably because it was the first .. the "magic" is never quite the same on your second and subsequent MUDs. I found it using "gofer" on a 2400 baud modem. Lol, I sound like an old man talking about how tough it used to be walking to work barefoot in the snow

Oh, the mud in question was the original Valhalla (not the VME one - this one closed its doors in 95/96) if anyone remembers it.

[Silver Phoenix]

First MUD is different. On your first MUD you are willing to try harder learn more, and you have nothing else to compare to so it seems to be the funnest thing in the world. Then you get kinda spoiled MUD-wise but you still like your first MUD because you overcome the learning barrier already.

[Nodeka]

Originally Posted by Silver Phoenix First MUD is different. On your first MUD you are willing to try harder learn more, and you have nothing else to compare to so it seems to be the funnest thing in the world. Then you get kinda spoiled MUD-wise but you still like your first MUD because you overcome the learning barrier already.

If you spent as much time on newworlds as you have complaining about how you couldn't play you would probably know a lot more by now.

Not all muds are for everyone. Lets try not to talk badly about other peoples muds just because its not for us =)

[Newworlds]

Originally Posted by Nodeka If you spent as much time on newworlds as you have complaining about how you couldn't play you would probably know a lot more by now. Not all muds are for everyone. Lets try not to talk badly about other peoples muds just because its not for us =)

Let thy name be had for good or bad thy profit share shall na're be sad. -Zen, Art of Marketing

Keep the good or bad talking coming. Just make sure you spell the name right!

[Silver Phoenix]

Meant no offense, NewWorlds, just not my kind of thing.

Back to my search for group MUD, I guess I just gave too many requirements and hence little replies. How about I simplify it: looking for a MUD with a channel for people who want to group or list of people who want to group you can add yourself to.

All suggestions are appreciated and will try them all

Oh, and still has to be free and no pay for perks (I had to quit Achaea at level 70 because at that time you get no more credits for leveling and you need to spend thousands (literally) of hours of repetitive solo questing to max your skills)

[Newworlds]

No offense taken at all Silver. We get several new players a day trying NW and on average only 1 in 5 make it out of the Immigrancy and into a guild in our game mainly because of the RP enforced style and requirements of the game.

I will give you some advice though. While you might find other games that are group oriented. It is highly unlikely you will find a game that is group oriented that the groups are seeking level 1 to 5 characters to join them. This is natural. You have to at least be somebody that offers something to the group to have them want you on the team.

Having said that, NW is likely one of the most immigrant (new player) oriented games on the net, having events and special catering to such. You just have to stick around long enough to see that and more importantly get into a guild to actually have people wanted to make you part of their team. I'm pretty certain you will find this reaction no matter where you go. As I said above, most if not all games will not be jumping up and down to have some low level character join their adventuring group.

Good luck with your search.