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Spoke · 08-01-2005, 05:37 PM

I am a player in a MUD with a large player-base (), PvP is optional yet there is a large number of people involved in it. This discussion is meant to discuss what does people look for when they get involved in PvP, what do people like or dislike of PvP, and general opinions on PvP in general.

My own experience with PvP tells me that interactions of the Player-vs-Player type in H&S MUDs depend largelly in a handful of factors, of which the more important will always depend on the specific coding of the MUD, some of them are:

*) Relative levels of the players: This usually is reflected on the skills/spells available to the players, as well as some type of level-check when using said skills-spells.

In my opinion this is a necesary feature, if you wish to balance those long term players with much more equipment in a MU* with remorts, this way a low level-high remort player would not be able to just destroy anybody on lower remorts due to the equipment advantage. The drawback is that two players with similar equipment, and time playing, but a few levels difference may have in this the key difference that determines the outcome of a fight.

*) Quality and ammount of equipment: This is something that I assume would affect all kinds of PvP interaction, both in RP and H&S MUDs. Players in any kind of MUD are required to obtain a set of tools they use to advance/survive in their world, and these same tools are what they use to engage combat against other players.

In the MUD I particularly play, this is a major point, since there is equipment you can only obtain through questing, and if you do not have quest-only weapons, you pretty much are in a huge disadvantage compared to others. The bright side is that these weapons are not too hard to come-by, and any dedicated player can get a few of them every remort, and have a decent set after 3 or so remorts (there are 7 remorts total, and something called "tiers" beyond the 7 remorts). Other than weapons, all other quest equipment is surelly a nice addition, but it is not something necesary. I believe this is important, if you want many people to be part of your PvP system, you need to make it available to a broad player pool. You do not want it to be a requisite to have spent thousands of hours (or dollars) to just be able to start competing.

*) Class/Classes - Character Build: Some MUDs have a restricted remort system, others have a classless system, others yet have a no-remort system. In all these there is usually a way to specialize your character, you choose to be a thief and therefore practice all the stealth skills, poison skills, etc. Or you choose to be a mage and learn the arts of fire, lightning, air, etc.
Your specific class, or skill choise gives you some advantages and disadvantages with respect to other players choices.

I personally like to be able to customize my character, so that 2 characters with the same classes, same remorts, and even similar equipment do not necesary excel in the same areas. In the MUD I play this is accomplished through trainable stats, which determine which spells/skills work better for you. I love the fact that someone with lower stat count can still compete against others if they know how to use the advantage their specific training gives them, also, someone who knows how to use thief skills properlly might find it to be a huge advantage when fighting against someone who has these skills available but does not understand how do they work.

*) Quest only/RL Money only/Unique items/skills/etc: Some MUDs have items/skills/etc available only through some intensive play or through RL investments. Items or skills obtained this way usually give the players some higher advantage in some aspect of their game, and when this advantage affects PvP, it does many times affect largely the outcome of the player's interactions.

In my opinion a MUDs admin must be careful when designing these unique or very hard to come-by items. In a H&S type of MUD where you probably are able to keep said items forever, once you get a hold of them, and they will empower you starting at the moment you obtain them, this becomes a balance challenge. If you add too many of these items, and allow them to be too powerful, you might end up with a long term headache in balance OR you might end up with players just too powerful for their level/# of remorts. An intelligently done system might add these bonuses in areas that either slightly affect PvP or that are available to everybody through other means. Unique and powerful items or skills available mainly through RL money would be something to be careful with. If these items are obtained mostly through money investment then maybe new players who wish to take part on PvP would have to wait longer or just make heavy money investments in order to compete, which might potentially reduce the total number of players willing to give PvP a try. In the MUD I play the quest items are available to everybody, and powerful items/affects, while available to all, are time-consuming to obtain, giving an advantage to long-term-playing characters. This though, does not play a overwhelmingly important role for someone to not be able to enjoy PvP in the lower leagues or against someone they have certain advantage to, in the other areas mentioned.

*) Player skill: How a player uses their available pool of items, skills, spells in order to compete against other players.

I left this for last item, but I believe is the most important item when talking about PvP in a MU*. This is the sole reason I like to engage PvP against others, because it requires skill on my side. It can also be a factor that outweights all other factors mentioned before if the MU* (this is my opinion) is smartly coded, and can make player interaction much more entertaining. It is important to note though, that it is not the ability to stack an "intelligently"-chosen set of skills/spells, but more the ability to respond to what the other player does or how the other player is affected by what you do. If, for example, your flaming weapon seems to be dealing less damage than usual, you might think on swapping for a different weapon (that big axe that cleaves them appart), or if you will be attacking a giant, you might think on using those mental powers of your psionicist or mage. I enjoy the most when someone whom by numbers should destroy me every time, dies due to a lower comprehension of their character skills.

This is, I think, a good summary of what I think is important for player PvP in my own opinion, what do you think is important when you engage PvP? what are the specific things you look for in a MUD that allows PvP? do you like PvP optional/forcing/free MU*'s? why?

Thanks for your time reading this.

08-01-2005, 05:37 PM	#1
Spoke Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 101	I am a player in a MUD with a large player-base (), PvP is optional yet there is a large number of people involved in it. This discussion is meant to discuss what does people look for when they get involved in PvP, what do people like or dislike of PvP, and general opinions on PvP in general. My own experience with PvP tells me that interactions of the Player-vs-Player type in H&S MUDs depend largelly in a handful of factors, of which the more important will always depend on the specific coding of the MUD, some of them are: ) Relative levels of the players: This usually is reflected on the skills/spells available to the players, as well as some type of level-check when using said skills-spells. In my opinion this is a necesary feature, if you wish to balance those long term players with much more equipment in a MU with remorts, this way a low level-high remort player would not be able to just destroy anybody on lower remorts due to the equipment advantage. The drawback is that two players with similar equipment, and time playing, but a few levels difference may have in this the key difference that determines the outcome of a fight. ) Quality and ammount of equipment: This is something that I assume would affect all kinds of PvP interaction, both in RP and H&S MUDs. Players in any kind of MUD are required to obtain a set of tools they use to advance/survive in their world, and these same tools are what they use to engage combat against other players. In the MUD I particularly play, this is a major point, since there is equipment you can only obtain through questing, and if you do not have quest-only weapons, you pretty much are in a huge disadvantage compared to others. The bright side is that these weapons are not too hard to come-by, and any dedicated player can get a few of them every remort, and have a decent set after 3 or so remorts (there are 7 remorts total, and something called "tiers" beyond the 7 remorts). Other than weapons, all other quest equipment is surelly a nice addition, but it is not something necesary. I believe this is important, if you want many people to be part of your PvP system, you need to make it available to a broad player pool. You do not want it to be a requisite to have spent thousands of hours (or dollars) to just be able to start competing. ) Class/Classes - Character Build: Some MUDs have a restricted remort system, others have a classless system, others yet have a no-remort system. In all these there is usually a way to specialize your character, you choose to be a thief and therefore practice all the stealth skills, poison skills, etc. Or you choose to be a mage and learn the arts of fire, lightning, air, etc. Your specific class, or skill choise gives you some advantages and disadvantages with respect to other players choices. I personally like to be able to customize my character, so that 2 characters with the same classes, same remorts, and even similar equipment do not necesary excel in the same areas. In the MUD I play this is accomplished through trainable stats, which determine which spells/skills work better for you. I love the fact that someone with lower stat count can still compete against others if they know how to use the advantage their specific training gives them, also, someone who knows how to use thief skills properlly might find it to be a huge advantage when fighting against someone who has these skills available but does not understand how do they work. ) Quest only/RL Money only/Unique items/skills/etc: Some MUDs have items/skills/etc available only through some intensive play or through RL investments. Items or skills obtained this way usually give the players some higher advantage in some aspect of their game, and when this advantage affects PvP, it does many times affect largely the outcome of the player's interactions. In my opinion a MUDs admin must be careful when designing these unique or very hard to come-by items. In a H&S type of MUD where you probably are able to keep said items forever, once you get a hold of them, and they will empower you starting at the moment you obtain them, this becomes a balance challenge. If you add too many of these items, and allow them to be too powerful, you might end up with a long term headache in balance OR you might end up with players just too powerful for their level/# of remorts. An intelligently done system might add these bonuses in areas that either slightly affect PvP or that are available to everybody through other means. Unique and powerful items or skills available mainly through RL money would be something to be careful with. If these items are obtained mostly through money investment then maybe new players who wish to take part on PvP would have to wait longer or just make heavy money investments in order to compete, which might potentially reduce the total number of players willing to give PvP a try. In the MUD I play the quest items are available to everybody, and powerful items/affects, while available to all, are time-consuming to obtain, giving an advantage to long-term-playing characters. This though, does not play a overwhelmingly important role for someone to not be able to enjoy PvP in the lower leagues or against someone they have certain advantage to, in the other areas mentioned. ) Player skill: How a player uses their available pool of items, skills, spells in order to compete against other players. I left this for last item, but I believe is the most important item when talking about PvP in a MU. This is the sole reason I like to engage PvP against others, because it requires skill on my side. It can also be a factor that outweights all other factors mentioned before if the MU (this is my opinion) is smartly coded, and can make player interaction much more entertaining. It is important to note though, that it is not the ability to stack an "intelligently"-chosen set of skills/spells, but more the ability to respond to what the other player does or how the other player is affected by what you do. If, for example, your flaming weapon seems to be dealing less damage than usual, you might think on swapping for a different weapon (that big axe that cleaves them appart), or if you will be attacking a giant, you might think on using those mental powers of your psionicist or mage. I enjoy the most when someone whom by numbers should destroy me every time, dies due to a lower comprehension of their character skills. This is, I think, a good summary of what I think is important for player PvP in my own opinion, what do you think is important when you engage PvP? what are the specific things you look for in a MUD that allows PvP? do you like PvP optional/forcing/free MU*'s? why? Thanks for your time reading this.