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camlorn · 07-24-2012, 11:50 AM

Well, moo and java are totally different--the libraries alone take up a few megabytes and each 2-dimensional array has more overhead. Every object has reference counters...I can go on, but you probably get the point. Java really isn't comparable to moo--moo was optimized for space in a specific domain over time, and has most of the underlying code in c. If you write in java, you've got all of the overhead for your world plus all of the overhead of writing the libraries yourself, and it can grow quite quickly. Scala adds another megabyte to this simply for using scala, and even more if you start using mixins and multiple inheritence (not natively available on the jvm). It really depends on what you're doing, but if I were to do something like wayfar1444, it'd be quite a bit larger than 300 mb, probably (before optimizations--I'm sure there's ways to make this smaller, but it's probably not woorth it: just get a vps or host from a box at home).

As for the situation with blind players, and I'm very surprised that someone hasn't done this yet, there really isn't an upper limit. Until someone comes along and makes a blind-accessible mmorpg, muds are the closest thing to World of Warcraft. I suspect muds could get quite a few more players if they targetted the blind community, but I have yet to see someone seriously do that. Most blind people that I know aren't even aware that such things exist.

As for "fighting over" the blind players on miriani or star conquest, your loss. A lot of those players play both, and I suspect quite a few wouldn't mind adding a third, and there's sites like audiogames.net to advertise on--miriani, alter aeon, and star conquest are a sort of cluster, but there are more blind players out there spread far and wide. I've spoken to you of this before and you've made it clear you don't care, so your loss (I don't quite blame you, but I really wish you would reconsider). We're not a finite resource--there's something like a million blind people in the United States (not sure on this and can't site a source, but it is a large number all the same--my parents keep up with that kind of thing, and it is apparently growing with the population). This is from wikipedia:

In 1994-1995, 1.3 million Americans reported legal blindness.

Siting as it's source the American Foundation for the Blind, which I can vouch for as being a reputable source (me and my family have been to some of their conferences). You have to count out those who are blind for reasons which would cause difficulty playing muds, but I still hold to my point that, if targetted properly, that's a sizeable number of potential players.

But I'm derailing the thread (which was necroed, anyway), and am starting in on a rant.

ps: I didn't read the source. As all things wikipedia, take it with a grain of salt.

07-24-2012, 11:50 AM	#58
camlorn Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 144	Re: Can MUDs implement range/distance? Well, moo and java are totally different--the libraries alone take up a few megabytes and each 2-dimensional array has more overhead. Every object has reference counters...I can go on, but you probably get the point. Java really isn't comparable to moo--moo was optimized for space in a specific domain over time, and has most of the underlying code in c. If you write in java, you've got all of the overhead for your world plus all of the overhead of writing the libraries yourself, and it can grow quite quickly. Scala adds another megabyte to this simply for using scala, and even more if you start using mixins and multiple inheritence (not natively available on the jvm). It really depends on what you're doing, but if I were to do something like wayfar1444, it'd be quite a bit larger than 300 mb, probably (before optimizations--I'm sure there's ways to make this smaller, but it's probably not woorth it: just get a vps or host from a box at home). As for the situation with blind players, and I'm very surprised that someone hasn't done this yet, there really isn't an upper limit. Until someone comes along and makes a blind-accessible mmorpg, muds are the closest thing to World of Warcraft. I suspect muds could get quite a few more players if they targetted the blind community, but I have yet to see someone seriously do that. Most blind people that I know aren't even aware that such things exist. As for "fighting over" the blind players on miriani or star conquest, your loss. A lot of those players play both, and I suspect quite a few wouldn't mind adding a third, and there's sites like audiogames.net to advertise on--miriani, alter aeon, and star conquest are a sort of cluster, but there are more blind players out there spread far and wide. I've spoken to you of this before and you've made it clear you don't care, so your loss (I don't quite blame you, but I really wish you would reconsider). We're not a finite resource--there's something like a million blind people in the United States (not sure on this and can't site a source, but it is a large number all the same--my parents keep up with that kind of thing, and it is apparently growing with the population). This is from wikipedia: In 1994-1995, 1.3 million Americans reported legal blindness. Siting as it's source the American Foundation for the Blind, which I can vouch for as being a reputable source (me and my family have been to some of their conferences). You have to count out those who are blind for reasons which would cause difficulty playing muds, but I still hold to my point that, if targetted properly, that's a sizeable number of potential players. But I'm derailing the thread (which was necroed, anyway), and am starting in on a rant. ps: I didn't read the source. As all things wikipedia, take it with a grain of salt.