Top Mud Sites Forum - View Single Post - Aardwolf commercially violating diku licence

KaVir · 10-27-2003, 05:06 AM

The topic was pretty much identical to the Aardwolf situation. Here's how the conversation went (quoted):

On 29 Aug 2000, I wrote:

A ROM mud by the name of "Dark and Shattered Lands" has started taking donations from the players in exchange for houses/taverns/land ownership within the game. In short:

$10 or more = 2 bedroom house for a character
$20 or more = 4 bedroom house for a character
$30 or more = A dsl-mud.org email alias
$100 or more = All shops but Taverns
$200 or more = A Tavern
$500 or more = Land Ownership to build a Kingdom

The real problem is that the mud owner (Tony Allen) is claiming that you (the Diku team) support this idea. If that's so, it makes it very hard to do anything about Medievia's (or any other muds) donation system - can you please confirm or deny whether he has your support on this issue?

On 29 Aug 2000 Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt replied:

Well, he is clearly using the game for generating profit.

I feel it is important that i make clear how i see the limits of the licence; You should know i am not against donations as such, and he may sell his merchandise as he pleases, but he may not use the game directly for this. The way i usually define this is if the players get some tangible modification within the game for their donations. Then it becomes commercialized. They pay for a service that is within the game.

I have no wish, nor any legal background for stopping donations made from commercials on the website, that offer no compensation game-wise. Nor have i any wish for preventing people selling merchandise on their website, that is related to the game (titled tshirts, mousepads etc..) .. in fact i recommend that you get your money this way.

On 30 Aug 2000, Michael Seifert wrote:

I regret to tell you that Richard is right. It is the intention of the license agreement that you should not receive for donations.

On 30 Aug 2000, Scorn (owner of DSL) wrote:

Would it be safe to assume some of the founders of DikuMud disagree on the license? Also, why is the intent of the license different than the license? The license states you can not make profit. It does not state you may not accept donations such as books, hardware or allowing someone else to pay your co-location fees.

I am not arguing, but I am severly confused at this point why I am being told I am violating an agreement that does not state anything against such activity. Also realzie that I will comply with the wishes of the Diku Team whether it is in writing or not. I have already removed the donation page on my web site but I ask for a fair and reasonable answer to my conerns on this matter.

On 1 Sep 2000 Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt replied:

I do not believe that we disagree on the license.

I am sorry, if my answers have been confusing. I just want to make clear where exactly the licence applies. And that is of course where using the sourcecode we have supplied, or sourcecode derived from our work.

If you give people any in-game benefits for their donations, you are in fact giving a service for the money you have rescieved. That is a commercial transaction, and thus you are commercializing our work. This we object to.

What i wanted to make clear, is that legally and morally we have no control of what you do, that you do not use our work for. Thus, if you want to sell mousepads and whatever from your website, we will not object.

If people want to donate money to you, personally, without having any services rendered using our software, we will not object to this. But if you use our software to render services for money or goods you rescieve, this we object to, as you are then commercializing our software. That we object to.

10-27-2003, 05:06 AM	#37
KaVir Legend Join Date: Apr 2002 Name: Richard Home MUD: God Wars II Posts: 2,052	The topic was pretty much identical to the Aardwolf situation. Here's how the conversation went (quoted): On 29 Aug 2000, I wrote: A ROM mud by the name of "Dark and Shattered Lands" has started taking donations from the players in exchange for houses/taverns/land ownership within the game. In short: $10 or more = 2 bedroom house for a character $20 or more = 4 bedroom house for a character $30 or more = A dsl-mud.org email alias $100 or more = All shops but Taverns $200 or more = A Tavern $500 or more = Land Ownership to build a Kingdom The real problem is that the mud owner (Tony Allen) is claiming that you (the Diku team) support this idea. If that's so, it makes it very hard to do anything about Medievia's (or any other muds) donation system - can you please confirm or deny whether he has your support on this issue? On 29 Aug 2000 Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt replied: Well, he is clearly using the game for generating profit. I feel it is important that i make clear how i see the limits of the licence; You should know i am not against donations as such, and he may sell his merchandise as he pleases, but he may not use the game directly for this. The way i usually define this is if the players get some tangible modification within the game for their donations. Then it becomes commercialized. They pay for a service that is within the game. I have no wish, nor any legal background for stopping donations made from commercials on the website, that offer no compensation game-wise. Nor have i any wish for preventing people selling merchandise on their website, that is related to the game (titled tshirts, mousepads etc..) .. in fact i recommend that you get your money this way. On 30 Aug 2000, Michael Seifert wrote: I regret to tell you that Richard is right. It is the intention of the license agreement that you should not receive for donations. On 30 Aug 2000, Scorn (owner of DSL) wrote: Would it be safe to assume some of the founders of DikuMud disagree on the license? Also, why is the intent of the license different than the license? The license states you can not make profit. It does not state you may not accept donations such as books, hardware or allowing someone else to pay your co-location fees. I am not arguing, but I am severly confused at this point why I am being told I am violating an agreement that does not state anything against such activity. Also realzie that I will comply with the wishes of the Diku Team whether it is in writing or not. I have already removed the donation page on my web site but I ask for a fair and reasonable answer to my conerns on this matter. On 1 Sep 2000 Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt replied: I do not believe that we disagree on the license. I am sorry, if my answers have been confusing. I just want to make clear where exactly the licence applies. And that is of course where using the sourcecode we have supplied, or sourcecode derived from our work. If you give people any in-game benefits for their donations, you are in fact giving a service for the money you have rescieved. That is a commercial transaction, and thus you are commercializing our work. This we object to. What i wanted to make clear, is that legally and morally we have no control of what you do, that you do not use our work for. Thus, if you want to sell mousepads and whatever from your website, we will not object. If people want to donate money to you, personally, without having any services rendered using our software, we will not object to this. But if you use our software to render services for money or goods you rescieve, this we object to, as you are then commercializing our software. That we object to.