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Anasadi · 08-29-2008, 05:59 PM

Thanks for the replies, all.

Orrin, we also allow player theft, and in fact have a career choice perfectly suited to it. But we don't allow thievery of player characters without the rogue being pk joined. I do not know if players would want to play a thief if they can rob mobs only.

Will, you make some good points, and they are some we've observed in our game. We have players who loot their victims then immediately pass it on to their out-of-pk-range friends. Or they might give the item(s) to a no-kill mob. Player characters (in our game) also get a 'private stash' that stays with them after death and that allows them to place six items in it. Most use it for quest items and other important objects. Some use it to stash away items that once belonged to their victims, making the items unreachable. Players can be counted on to take a good idea and make it rotten.

Battling over items can be healthy. And believe me when I say we have tried numerous techniques to keep power looting to a minimum. For example, we made player corpses harder to loot by making them one-item-at-a-time for non-owners, and we added a brief time delay on such actions by looters. So smarter looters started using their charmed mobs, which can loot corpses as much as they want, to get around the restrictions. We made it so charmed mobs have to follow the same rules. So smart looters charmed multiple mobs, ordered all to loot the corpse at the same time, etc. We haven't yet disallowed charmed mob from looting at all, because what is the use? A player gets three friends, all in the same pk range, and they attack and kill the loner. They all loot at the same time, four items at a time. Thus we are back where we started, power looting. So we make it so the final player to land the blow gets to loot. Unfortunately, the one who wants the item(s) didn't land the final blow, and as the item is no-drop, his friend cannot really grab it either without dying later. And on and on.

The victims can recover their items, provided they can get to them. Usually they have to kill their killer. This may prove impossible if their killer is part of a group or the killer has made the item(s) unreachable, giving them to friends, to mobs and so on.

They could form a group of their own to get their items back, if there are player characters to do so. That's one of the problems of having a small player base on a player killer mud. A small player base also means there are fewer experienced players to advise newcomers on the craft of player killing. Thus people new to player killing likely won't be able to get their items from more experienced players. I'm not complaining, just stating what we've found, and how we have approached this particular problem.

So I agree, Will, player looting is not necessarily a bad thing. But I am still of the mind that player killing and player looting do not necessarily have to be tied. Some of you, like Ide, have confirmed this. Thanks again, everyone.

08-29-2008, 05:59 PM	#8
Anasadi New Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 25	Re: Player Killing and Player Looting Thanks for the replies, all. Orrin, we also allow player theft, and in fact have a career choice perfectly suited to it. But we don't allow thievery of player characters without the rogue being pk joined. I do not know if players would want to play a thief if they can rob mobs only. Will, you make some good points, and they are some we've observed in our game. We have players who loot their victims then immediately pass it on to their out-of-pk-range friends. Or they might give the item(s) to a no-kill mob. Player characters (in our game) also get a 'private stash' that stays with them after death and that allows them to place six items in it. Most use it for quest items and other important objects. Some use it to stash away items that once belonged to their victims, making the items unreachable. Players can be counted on to take a good idea and make it rotten. Battling over items can be healthy. And believe me when I say we have tried numerous techniques to keep power looting to a minimum. For example, we made player corpses harder to loot by making them one-item-at-a-time for non-owners, and we added a brief time delay on such actions by looters. So smarter looters started using their charmed mobs, which can loot corpses as much as they want, to get around the restrictions. We made it so charmed mobs have to follow the same rules. So smart looters charmed multiple mobs, ordered all to loot the corpse at the same time, etc. We haven't yet disallowed charmed mob from looting at all, because what is the use? A player gets three friends, all in the same pk range, and they attack and kill the loner. They all loot at the same time, four items at a time. Thus we are back where we started, power looting. So we make it so the final player to land the blow gets to loot. Unfortunately, the one who wants the item(s) didn't land the final blow, and as the item is no-drop, his friend cannot really grab it either without dying later. And on and on. The victims can recover their items, provided they can get to them. Usually they have to kill their killer. This may prove impossible if their killer is part of a group or the killer has made the item(s) unreachable, giving them to friends, to mobs and so on. They could form a group of their own to get their items back, if there are player characters to do so. That's one of the problems of having a small player base on a player killer mud. A small player base also means there are fewer experienced players to advise newcomers on the craft of player killing. Thus people new to player killing likely won't be able to get their items from more experienced players. I'm not complaining, just stating what we've found, and how we have approached this particular problem. So I agree, Will, player looting is not necessarily a bad thing. But I am still of the mind that player killing and player looting do not necessarily have to be tied. Some of you, like Ide, have confirmed this. Thanks again, everyone.