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Kleothera · 08-19-2008, 03:18 PM

Well. I spent a few hours thinking about it, and went back to ponder at the original post about Player Rights.

I think part of the reason behind the lack of agreement is the classical problem with the concept of Rights when taken without the concept of Responsibilities. This is from what I know of legal jurisprudence also a major problem with the concept in RL law. At the same time, the situation in which we are situating rights is markedly different from RL. The rights a player has is situated in the overall socio-political (I am really talking geek speak now), context of how the particular game has evolved to deal with players. Seeing the amount of disagreement we are having (and going by the passion with which some of the replies were written) the discussion is moving towards an understanding of the role that players vs imms have and should have in MUDs. At the same time, even if we agree on a certain minimum ethical standard on treating players (if the word rights is too strong for people), some people have asked how this standard would be implemented.

Some articles I have seen on this today (and I havent read completely yet, largely because its past midnight and I am beginning to ramble while writing) are below.

An interesting paper I found on the issue of the powers of Gods in the context of online games, esp MUDS (by Richard Bartle) which gives an interesting classification of how different MUD systems have evolved to govern their players-

A classical case study of the experiment with (and effectively failure of) a democratic online community is that of Pavel Curtis' LambdaMoo. I havent read the full link below, however, it appears to give an overall history. The book I had read earlier was about this game.

How customary law in MUDs emerge in situations where relations between imms and citizens are unequal.

Really interesting and to be fair, off topic

Handling player run political systems in a MUD

Anyway, my point here is that perhaps we may want to look at the OP and ask ourselves a set of questions-

1. Do you think we as a community should perhaps expect a minimum voluntary code of ethics to deal with players in games?Y/N
2. What is the shortest possible list of the things that a God should not do to his players on a MUD in terms of the treatment given. (until a better word is found, rights) Are there any things that staff shouldn't do to their players- no matter what?
3. Perhaps what is a minimum list of things you would expect from players in return in terms of the above civil behaviour? (responsibilities)
4. Assuming we agree on something on some of the above issues, perhaps the next question would be on how would we make this wishlist into a customary law in the MUD community- or atleast as a beginning among the readers of this forum.

08-19-2008, 03:18 PM	#29
Kleothera Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 50	Re: MUD Players' Bill of Rights Well. I spent a few hours thinking about it, and went back to ponder at the original post about Player Rights. I think part of the reason behind the lack of agreement is the classical problem with the concept of Rights when taken without the concept of Responsibilities. This is from what I know of legal jurisprudence also a major problem with the concept in RL law. At the same time, the situation in which we are situating rights is markedly different from RL. The rights a player has is situated in the overall socio-political (I am really talking geek speak now), context of how the particular game has evolved to deal with players. Seeing the amount of disagreement we are having (and going by the passion with which some of the replies were written) the discussion is moving towards an understanding of the role that players vs imms have and should have in MUDs. At the same time, even if we agree on a certain minimum ethical standard on treating players (if the word rights is too strong for people), some people have asked how this standard would be implemented. Some articles I have seen on this today (and I havent read completely yet, largely because its past midnight and I am beginning to ramble while writing) are below. An interesting paper I found on the issue of the powers of Gods in the context of online games, esp MUDS (by Richard Bartle) which gives an interesting classification of how different MUD systems have evolved to govern their players- A classical case study of the experiment with (and effectively failure of) a democratic online community is that of Pavel Curtis' LambdaMoo. I havent read the full link below, however, it appears to give an overall history. The book I had read earlier was about this game. How customary law in MUDs emerge in situations where relations between imms and citizens are unequal. Really interesting and to be fair, off topic Handling player run political systems in a MUD Anyway, my point here is that perhaps we may want to look at the OP and ask ourselves a set of questions- 1. Do you think we as a community should perhaps expect a minimum voluntary code of ethics to deal with players in games?Y/N 2. What is the shortest possible list of the things that a God should not do to his players on a MUD in terms of the treatment given. (until a better word is found, rights) Are there any things that staff shouldn't do to their players- no matter what? 3. Perhaps what is a minimum list of things you would expect from players in return in terms of the above civil behaviour? (responsibilities) 4. Assuming we agree on something on some of the above issues, perhaps the next question would be on how would we make this wishlist into a customary law in the MUD community- or atleast as a beginning among the readers of this forum.