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Keldar · 09-24-2002, 01:47 AM

OOOHKAAY! I've been following this thread since I first saw the line "Achaea's recent attempt to claim #1" in the Recent Forums section, and followed it up to about page 11 or so, then I simply got too sick to proceed any further. So, I'll throw in my 2 cents here and be gone on my own business...

First, let me give my own (no doubt, highly opinionated) view of how this entire thread came to be:

1. Some person posts about Achaea supposedly bribing its' players to vote for it on TMS. To anyone who's been playing Achaea for some time it was obvious that this post was a result of the lack of readiness to investigate the actual facts, or any care for those facts at all. The post was driven by hurt feelings of a devoted player who's game wasn't in the top slot (and it sure must be there, 'cause it's much better than that piece of trash Achaea, and if it wasn't for Achaea's cheatin', bribin', and lyin' staff, my MUD would be number 1, no doubt about it).

2. Other people who watch the section jump in and support the claims made in the original post, likewise not caring in the very least about the facts, ethical, or at least business considerations.

3. Several posts are made to bring some perspective into this Achaea bashing.

4. And the dirt slinging begins! People post the same arguments over and over and over again, completely ignoring responses to their claims, and attempts to inform them about their misconceptions (btw, it is considered rude to talk without taking plugs out of your ears). People are using vocabulary of an 8 year old school kid: liar, cheater, trash, shut up, asshole etc. The atmosphere becomes dense and humid, the blood is pumping in the ears, the fists are clenched to the point of fingernails ripping the flesh of the palms...

I must admit that I was getting increasingly excited myself, when all of a sudden I saw a reply to one of yig's posts (don't remember by whom), which made everything crystal clear to me and made me calm down immediately. The reply read almost literaly: "Shut up and take a walk, since you have no place being here, where the old folks meet." Aha! I said to myself - that's what this whole thing is about.

As the_logos has already said many times before, but no one seemed to care to listen: the TMS rankings are not to figure out who is best and who is not, it benefits the entire community, since players are exposed to a large number of excellent MUDs and have a chance to try them out if they haven't become hooked on one of them already. I can see the truth in that, since I myself visited the sites of a great many of MUDs in the rankings. However, when a person sees a rankings page in his browser, he also notices a little box with the names of the recent forum posts, and one of those names includes the name of the top ranking MUD, so the person clicks on the link (why not, lets see what maschinations have got them in the lead) and voila - he sees this place...

The place where imms, gods, and very-very old players meet to dig up some slime and throw it on their competitors. Allow me to say that no IG reward for OOC actions (giving a player access to an IG event for a bunch of OOC US$ is somehow justified as being entirely different in your rationale, but I am not going to investigate this logical paradox) can hurt the player's RP more than the posts in this very thread. All I have left from this discussion in my head right now are on one side of my brain the words "Achaea", "DragonRealms", "GemstoneIII", and on the other - "liars", "cheaters", "bribery", "idiot", "asshole", and the list goes on to merge into one single concept - "dirt".

In this sense I'd like to give y'all an advice, which comes from a player who hasn't spent years on any MUD and hasn't been an Immortal or a God anywhere, but who happens to be one of those people who make up your player bases: if you want to bash each other and sling slime on each other, and you have not a care in the world about what people like me or yig think or have to say, then why don't you make this thread private and in its' privacy perform executions of those you don't like or you feel jealous about or who simply needs a good beating in your opinion. That way you'll be able to let out some steam without hurting your own creations - your games.

Someone has said here that Achaea's Immortals slander the high image of Immortals in general, I don't see how they do, but I can clearly see the image of Immortals that this discussion is creating in my head, and it ain't pretty. That is why I won't allow this whole thang to interfere with the fun I am having in Achaea any further, and will definitely not come back to read any responses, which might be posted to this so y'all might as well not bother.

09-24-2002, 01:47 AM	#157
Keldar New Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 13	OOOHKAAY! I've been following this thread since I first saw the line "Achaea's recent attempt to claim #1" in the Recent Forums section, and followed it up to about page 11 or so, then I simply got too sick to proceed any further. So, I'll throw in my 2 cents here and be gone on my own business... First, let me give my own (no doubt, highly opinionated) view of how this entire thread came to be: 1. Some person posts about Achaea supposedly bribing its' players to vote for it on TMS. To anyone who's been playing Achaea for some time it was obvious that this post was a result of the lack of readiness to investigate the actual facts, or any care for those facts at all. The post was driven by hurt feelings of a devoted player who's game wasn't in the top slot (and it sure must be there, 'cause it's much better than that piece of trash Achaea, and if it wasn't for Achaea's cheatin', bribin', and lyin' staff, my MUD would be number 1, no doubt about it). 2. Other people who watch the section jump in and support the claims made in the original post, likewise not caring in the very least about the facts, ethical, or at least business considerations. 3. Several posts are made to bring some perspective into this Achaea bashing. 4. And the dirt slinging begins! People post the same arguments over and over and over again, completely ignoring responses to their claims, and attempts to inform them about their misconceptions (btw, it is considered rude to talk without taking plugs out of your ears). People are using vocabulary of an 8 year old school kid: liar, cheater, trash, shut up, asshole etc. The atmosphere becomes dense and humid, the blood is pumping in the ears, the fists are clenched to the point of fingernails ripping the flesh of the palms... I must admit that I was getting increasingly excited myself, when all of a sudden I saw a reply to one of yig's posts (don't remember by whom), which made everything crystal clear to me and made me calm down immediately. The reply read almost literaly: "Shut up and take a walk, since you have no place being here, where the old folks meet." Aha! I said to myself - that's what this whole thing is about. As the_logos has already said many times before, but no one seemed to care to listen: the TMS rankings are not to figure out who is best and who is not, it benefits the entire community, since players are exposed to a large number of excellent MUDs and have a chance to try them out if they haven't become hooked on one of them already. I can see the truth in that, since I myself visited the sites of a great many of MUDs in the rankings. However, when a person sees a rankings page in his browser, he also notices a little box with the names of the recent forum posts, and one of those names includes the name of the top ranking MUD, so the person clicks on the link (why not, lets see what maschinations have got them in the lead) and voila - he sees this place... The place where imms, gods, and very-very old players meet to dig up some slime and throw it on their competitors. Allow me to say that no IG reward for OOC actions (giving a player access to an IG event for a bunch of OOC US$ is somehow justified as being entirely different in your rationale, but I am not going to investigate this logical paradox) can hurt the player's RP more than the posts in this very thread. All I have left from this discussion in my head right now are on one side of my brain the words "Achaea", "DragonRealms", "GemstoneIII", and on the other - "liars", "cheaters", "bribery", "idiot", "asshole", and the list goes on to merge into one single concept - "dirt". In this sense I'd like to give y'all an advice, which comes from a player who hasn't spent years on any MUD and hasn't been an Immortal or a God anywhere, but who happens to be one of those people who make up your player bases: if you want to bash each other and sling slime on each other, and you have not a care in the world about what people like me or yig think or have to say, then why don't you make this thread private and in its' privacy perform executions of those you don't like or you feel jealous about or who simply needs a good beating in your opinion. That way you'll be able to let out some steam without hurting your own creations - your games. Someone has said here that Achaea's Immortals slander the high image of Immortals in general, I don't see how they do, but I can clearly see the image of Immortals that this discussion is creating in my head, and it ain't pretty. That is why I won't allow this whole thang to interfere with the fun I am having in Achaea any further, and will definitely not come back to read any responses, which might be posted to this so y'all might as well not bother.