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shadowfyr · 09-26-2003, 04:07 PM

This is actually something that bugs the #### out of me. Years ago, 25 or more.., I used a program called Telemate. It didn't even have a clue what Telnet was, since it was a pure dial-up application for use with BBSs. However, one thing it had in common with nearly all such clients is that it expected any BBS using the ANSI spec to send it an ANSI sequence requesting to use ANSI and it replied with a can-do repsonse. Then I got on the internet and started to play muds. All of the sudden this 'basic' feature was missing. Why?

The one I play on right now uses ANSI, but you have to turn it on in the terminal options, because it won't send a 4-5 byte request the istant you connect to find out if you have ANSI. Others turn it on by default, which they can get by with because even MS telnet, which is the worst client in existance, as near as I can tell, recognizes the codes. Last I checked this is 2003, there is even extensions like MXP around that 3-4 programs use and 'require' negotiation to work properly, but muds can't do something that basic dial-up BBSs could do half a century ago. This isn't about telnet and what variation of it someone may be using, it is basic common sense imho. It make no sense at all that this isn't a standard feature of 'all' muds by now, no matter how old the code base.

Yes, there are some things that can't or won't work in specific instances, but something so silly and basic? As for things not supported, about the only major thing in VT100 not supported is things like text positioning. This is a trade off, most muds don't fake animation or graphics using these features, but send text that just continuously scrolls. A few do try to be clever and use it for things they could do without, at which point you run into a problem with about half or more of the clients, including Mushclient, which I use and is figthing it out toe to toe with zMud as the most versitile one around.

Well, some special text attributes and other tricks may not be either, but most of them are purely cosmetic, while color I would argue is so pervasive that not having it is practically a matter of basic function.

The blinking issue does bug me though. In Mushclient, the default is to treat blink as Italic, but that screws up maps. Supposedly this will get fixed in a 'much' later version, probably the same time a real port is developed that will run on Linux, though I haven't a clue how scripting will get implimented in that, since it currently relies on COM.

09-26-2003, 04:07 PM	#7
shadowfyr Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 310	This is actually something that bugs the #### out of me. Years ago, 25 or more.., I used a program called Telemate. It didn't even have a clue what Telnet was, since it was a pure dial-up application for use with BBSs. However, one thing it had in common with nearly all such clients is that it expected any BBS using the ANSI spec to send it an ANSI sequence requesting to use ANSI and it replied with a can-do repsonse. Then I got on the internet and started to play muds. All of the sudden this 'basic' feature was missing. Why? The one I play on right now uses ANSI, but you have to turn it on in the terminal options, because it won't send a 4-5 byte request the istant you connect to find out if you have ANSI. Others turn it on by default, which they can get by with because even MS telnet, which is the worst client in existance, as near as I can tell, recognizes the codes. Last I checked this is 2003, there is even extensions like MXP around that 3-4 programs use and 'require' negotiation to work properly, but muds can't do something that basic dial-up BBSs could do half a century ago. This isn't about telnet and what variation of it someone may be using, it is basic common sense imho. It make no sense at all that this isn't a standard feature of 'all' muds by now, no matter how old the code base. Yes, there are some things that can't or won't work in specific instances, but something so silly and basic? As for things not supported, about the only major thing in VT100 not supported is things like text positioning. This is a trade off, most muds don't fake animation or graphics using these features, but send text that just continuously scrolls. A few do try to be clever and use it for things they could do without, at which point you run into a problem with about half or more of the clients, including Mushclient, which I use and is figthing it out toe to toe with zMud as the most versitile one around. Well, some special text attributes and other tricks may not be either, but most of them are purely cosmetic, while color I would argue is so pervasive that not having it is practically a matter of basic function. The blinking issue does bug me though. In Mushclient, the default is to treat blink as Italic, but that screws up maps. Supposedly this will get fixed in a 'much' later version, probably the same time a real port is developed that will run on Linux, though I haven't a clue how scripting will get implimented in that, since it currently relies on COM.