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Old 09-19-2009, 01:59 AM   #21
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

Quote:
...cannot seem to discuss a point without bringing in personal attacks.
For personal attacks: see your comments in numerous above posts

Quote:
...your...RPI website.
The RPMUD Network is not "my" site. I just pay the bills. Operation of the site as well as approval of content is determined by a committee presently consisting of 7 members. Sometimes we all agree on things, sometimes we don't. Sometimes I'm on the side of the prevailing position, sometimes I'm not (in fact, I've been on the dissenting side in 3 of the last 6 discussions).

Nor is the RPMUD Network solely for RPIs. When completed it will encompass all RP-enforced MUDs, MUSHes, etc. The site's emphasis will be focused on the players' perspective by providing independent third-party collected data and critical review and analysis. There might be some other features as well but the Operating Committee is presently having schedule conflicts which have prevented us from meeting for almost two months now. Finding a new time for our meetings is proving difficult at the present time and hopefully will be easier later in the year. It's putting us behind schedule but at this point there's little else we can do.

Last edited by prof1515 : 09-19-2009 at 02:09 AM.
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Old 09-19-2009, 02:02 AM   #22
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

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Originally Posted by Newworlds View Post
RPI, RPG, RPWhatever. Revealing hidden motivations as a think command is completely unrealistic. Hidden thoughts should be shown by action, spoken word, and poses, not by thoughts shouted outloud. Using this method is similar to walking around with a LEVEL 50 stamped on your character's forehead. Think should never be used in a roleplay environment unless the game has methods of thoughts being heard by ability or powers.

In your example you would have the politician holding a sign above his head with his thoughts on it.
Your post reveals your ignorance. Other players can't see your think command. Only you can see what you think using the command. This command is merely there for your own expression of your character's thoughts.

If you'd ever played any RPI perhaps you'd know this.
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Old 09-19-2009, 02:17 AM   #23
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

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Originally Posted by prof1515 View Post
Your post reveals your ignorance. Other players can't see your think command. Only you can see what you think using the command. This command is merely there for your own expression of your character's thoughts.

If you'd ever played any RPI perhaps you'd know this.
Then my original post still stands true. If no one else sees it what is the point of the roleplaying command. Most MUDs don't let you talk, whisper, or attack yourself for this same reason that it is pointless. Are you saying these are also a requirement for your game as well?

The entire point of multi player roleplaying is interaction or didn't you know that?
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Old 09-19-2009, 02:18 AM   #24
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

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Originally Posted by prof1515 View Post
Your post reveals your ignorance. Other players can't see your think command. Only you can see what you think using the command. This command is merely there for your own expression of your character's thoughts.

If you'd ever played any RPI perhaps you'd know this.
Also, staff most likely have a channel where they can see active thinks and they are most likely logged as well. It proves exemplary roleplay and helps imms understand why you're doing something.

Immortal wonders why the hell player A is sneaking around in the criminal underworld.

Player A thinks: "I better get this contract for the assassination or my boss is going to rip me apart"

Immortal goes.. ooohh. Okay.
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Old 09-19-2009, 02:23 AM   #25
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

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Originally Posted by prof1515 View Post
The RPMUD Network is not "my" site. I just pay the bills. Operation of the site as well as approval of content is determined by a committee presently consisting of 7 members. Sometimes we all agree on things, sometimes we don't. Sometimes I'm on the side of the prevailing position, sometimes I'm not (in fact, I've been on the dissenting side in 3 of the last 6 discussions).
Why am I not suprised by this.

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Nor is the RPMUD Network solely for RPIs. When completed it will encompass all RP-enforced MUDs, MUSHes, etc...
Again your illusion of fact. I seriously doubt any true roleplaying MUDs will want to associate with your network, hence ALL is a bit of a stretch, no?
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Old 09-19-2009, 02:25 AM   #26
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

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Originally Posted by Delerak View Post
Also, staff most likely have a channel where they can see active thinks and they are most likely logged as well. It proves exemplary roleplay and helps imms understand why you're doing something.

Immortal wonders why the hell player A is sneaking around in the criminal underworld.

Player A thinks: "I better get this contract for the assassination or my boss is going to rip me apart"

Immortal goes.. ooohh. Okay.
Now that is a really good reason for the think command and I have played a MUD with this feature (for staff bonuses, interaction, or notice). I had forgotten about that one, Delerak.
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Old 09-19-2009, 02:33 AM   #27
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

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I seriously doubt any true roleplaying MUDs will want to associate with your network, hence ALL is a bit of a stretch, no?
This isn't a matter of wanting to do anything. Games do not list themselves. Our staff is collecting a list and data on each game. This way we hope to avoid the inevitable exagerrations and outright lies that many games incorporate into their listings on sites like TMS and TMC.

As for the word "true", I don't even care to ask what your definition is.
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Old 09-19-2009, 02:45 AM   #28
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

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Originally Posted by prof1515 View Post
This isn't a matter of wanting to do anything. Games do not list themselves. Our staff is collecting a list and data on each game. This way we hope to avoid the inevitable exagerrations and outright lies that many games incorporate into their listings on sites like TMS and TMC.

As for the word "true", I don't even care to ask what your definition is.
I'm glad "your" staff is collecting the data and avoiding exagerrations. I just realised that you aren't a professor Prof1515, you're a comedian. That's like the Democrats writing a report on the Republican Convention. Completely unbiased. Riiiiight.

Of course you don't care to ask anyone's definition of true for truth to you only comes from you, according to you, and substatiated by....yes, once again...you.
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Old 09-19-2009, 03:25 AM   #29
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

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Originally Posted by Newworlds View Post
I'm glad "your" staff is collecting the data and avoiding exagerrations.
Well they're not my staff since I don't have any control over them. I can't hire or fire them if I don't like what they do, say, think or feel. They're representative of many types of RP MU* experience. All data will be reviewed by the Committee and any reviews will be conducted by at least two members of the Committee to ensure that it's not just one perspective.

Quote:
Completely unbiased. Riiiiight.
Bias is always present. The difference comes from having the maturity to recognize your bias and rely upon facts and observations rather than opinion alone. Again, that's why there's a committee of multiple members. This helps provide multiple perspectives and identify unreasonable bias.
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Old 09-19-2009, 03:30 AM   #30
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

And will you ever be admitting to what your goal in funding this project is? And please don't think us naive enough to believe you are doing it out of your unselfish love for the MUD community, you might make us throw up.
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Old 09-19-2009, 07:27 AM   #31
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

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Originally Posted by Newworlds View Post
And will you ever be admitting to what your goal in funding this project is?
Wade was going to just let the old rpimud.com site shut down so I offered to continue paying the cost (it only costs me $84 a year and that total may actually go down considerably depending on the decisions of some upcoming discussions by the Operating Committee). As I am a polarizing figure, I did not want the site to come under claims of "bias" so I decided I would not run the site alone. I asked a number of prominent members of the site as well as members of Wade's existing team if they'd like to come on in the form of a committee to manage the site. Some didn't reply, some didn't have the time. Over time, some of the others found that they no longer had time due to other projects, life, etc. From the original four people on the committee, I'm the only one left. However, as each left, others came forward interested in volunteering to help. In 2008, with a total of five us, we established a formal charter organizing the site administration in the form of the Operating Committee with detailed protocols as to how we'd operate the site. This was done so that there was a clear, standardized operation of the site without preferential treatment for any particular game or type of game. To that end, we also changed the name from The RPIMUD Network to The RPMUD Network in order to be more inclusive, as the focus of the site was any role-play enforced game, not just RPIs. The Charter also established that there would be three seats, voted upon by the games who chose to participate. As we were starting out, we confined balloting last year to only those sites that were already listed on the old rpimud.com site. Hopefully we'll have contact information for all 300+ RPEs in time to send out the ballots this year.

And for the record, I'm happy to discontinue paying the costs if others would step up to volunteer the funding. As thus far no one has, I've been left with no alternative but to continue paying even though it is a drain on my wallet of money that I'd love to spend elsewhere.

Quote:
And please don't think us naive enough to believe you are doing it out of your unselfish love for the MUD community, you might make us throw up.
You keep attributing ideas, motives and even words to me that I don't use. Maybe you're a selfish, deceitful person but not everyone is. Puke all you want; some day you'll realize it's your own distasteful qualities that you're coughing up.

Last edited by prof1515 : 09-20-2009 at 06:09 AM.
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Old 09-19-2009, 08:36 AM   #32
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

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Originally Posted by Newworlds View Post
You claim to be some expert roleplayer, but you take a "brief look" at a MUD and make a determination?
Where in Warhound's post did he claim to be an "expert roleplayer"? Quit attributing things to people that they didn't say just so you can foam at the mouth about them.
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Old 09-19-2009, 12:06 PM   #33
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

You guys totally need to have a death match.
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Old 09-19-2009, 02:05 PM   #34
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

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Originally Posted by prof1515 View Post
Wade was going to just let the old rpimud.com site shut down so I offered to continue paying the cost (it only costs me $84 a year and that total may actually go down considerably depending on the decisions of some upcoming discussions by the Operating Committee). As I am a polarizing figure, blah blah blah...
Perhaps you just need to actually read and answer a question rather than going off on tangents like some cheap politician. In all that hogwash you never answered the basic question. Read it again and perhaps, try again. I know it is difficult when you are only thinking of deceit, selfishness, and distasteful qualities, but I think you can do it, I believe in you!

I also loved your comment on how polarizing you are. Oh the comedy.
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Old 09-19-2009, 02:19 PM   #35
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

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Where in Warhound's post did he claim to be an "expert roleplayer"? Quit attributing things to people that they didn't say just so you can foam at the mouth about them.
Hypocrit much? I love this: Where in my posts did I emote or say I was foaming at the mouth. Prof your hypocrisy is classic, but since you need a "history" lesson on his post I'll give it to you.

What you meant by "foaming at the mouth" was that my posts "sounded like" or "read like" I was foaming at the mouth in anger, et al. I get that, apparently you didn't.

Let's take a look at Warhound's comment:
Quote:
I figure that the crowd of, ah, posers, for lack of a better term, just want the association of 'elite' RP or whatever you want to call it, so they've snatched at the moniker to feel better. But anything more than a brief look will show you the shoddy paintjob, cheap rims, and less-than-intensive RP.
He is referring to his game and other games like his as lacking Elite RP. Elite/expert. Not too hard to wrap your mind around.
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Old 09-19-2009, 02:23 PM   #36
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

Elitism exists. So what? It only exists because it's true. Depending on your definition of elite-level roleplay. It depends on your perspective of what that is. For you and the players of New Worlds the very act of roleplaying itself could be something different than what those at RPI's such as Arm, SOI consider to be roleplaying. So being able to define the very highest caliber of roleplaying for each mud is kind of difficult if both muds consider roleplaying itself not to have a common ground. Which is just silly.
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Old 09-19-2009, 02:41 PM   #37
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

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Originally Posted by Delerak View Post
Elitism exists. So what? It only exists because it's true. Depending on your definition of elite-level roleplay. It depends on your perspective of what that is. For you and the players of New Worlds the very act of roleplaying itself could be something different than what those at RPI's such as Arm, SOI consider to be roleplaying. So being able to define the very highest caliber of roleplaying for each mud is kind of difficult if both muds consider roleplaying itself not to have a common ground. Which is just silly.
Well put, I agree with this.
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Old 09-19-2009, 03:11 PM   #38
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

Its such a shame that a small / shrinking community spends so much time playing one upmanship and engaging in arguments over semantics instead of trying to strengthen the community and keeping these arguments to private posts.

Anyone taking a small dip into the world of muds and finding this site is not going to stay long with some of the attitudes on display.

Just my two pence worth as I am tired of my 'every other day; visits to the mudding world ends up in reading the same old tired arguments instead of potentially getting excited by new developments / ideas / worlds.

By the way, I am a player, not a developer. I am not also aiming this post ant any speicifc person on these threads.

and as I see it *staying on topic) as a PLAYER

RPI - When you play the game you are in character ALWAYS.. with limited channels for OOC communication which can be switched off for immersive play. Any out of character communication is strictly forbbiden when in the game arena. Examples Threshold, Armageddon. I tend to steer clear of this kind of game now as people tend to lose the grip between their real selves and personaes when engaging in OOC chat.

RP - Every other game where you create an avatar and play that person. Doesnt matter what you do / say in the game, you just take a role and start playing.. maybe you act, maybe you dont. I would put something like Gemstone in this bracket.. some people do the 'acting' but will quite happily discuss game mechanics as well.. nice and relaxed and you never get so immersed you forget its a game.

Why be more complex than that? All MUD:s are effectivly Role PLaying games as far as I can tell.
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Old 09-19-2009, 03:15 PM   #39
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

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Why be more complex than that? All MUD:s are effectivly Role PLaying games as far as I can tell.
Personal preference.

Your post doesn't really read very educated either as you listed Threshold as an RPI. It clearly is not. There are more aspects that make a mud RPI rather then just staying in-character at all times. The most prominent being permanent death, and an realistic world design.

People can play what they want, but every mud is going to be proud of itself. That's just the norme. People get fanatic over one game a lot. I think it's stupid, but it happens and always will happen. You will have players that are obsessed over one mud and that's it. So they will fight tooth and nail for their point of views and opinions to be the correct ones.
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Old 09-19-2009, 03:55 PM   #40
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Re: RPI, RPE, and Roleplay

Quote:
Originally Posted by Delerak View Post
A log from New Worlds
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Originally Posted by Delerak View Post
A log from arm.
A log from GW2:

Code:
Tokugawa chats, 'Lets rp!'
Tokugawa chats, 'I am Tokugawa, lord of all.'
Tokugawa chats, 'You can all be peasants.'
Tokugawa chats, 'Ok, GO!'
Thecreator chats, 'Oy, **** you. I'm higher on the who list.'
Tulmyn chats, 'Hell, Even I am. lol.'
Tokugawa chats, 'You're a peasant damnit.'
Tokugawa chats, 'RP properly.'
Thecreator chats, 'No, your sense of reality is skewed, tok.'
Tokugawa chats, 'I put on my robe and wizard hat.'
Thecreator chats, 'Ok.'
Tazik chats, 'I start using the Rhino fighting style.'
Tulmyn chats, 'Symon, lets stage the world's most cheesy overthrow then. :D.'
Tokugawa chats, '>=D.'
Thecreator chats, 'I use my skills as a bat and bite you repetedly until you die, taking the throen. there!'
Tokugawa chats, 'Peasants dont overthrow.'
Tokugawa chats, 'You go pick some potatoes.'
Thecreator chats, 'The **** if they don't.'
Tulmyn chats, 'Lol. See? Same thoughts.'
Tokugawa chats, 'You enjoy picking potatoes.'
Tokugawa chats, 'You eat some of the potatoes because you can't afford good food.'
Tazik chats, 'As someone from Russia, I feel inclined to disagree with you. :P.'
Thecreator chats, 'Waaaaa.'
[INFO] Ragnar has returned to God Wars II.
Thecreator chats, 'How does a bat pick potatos?'
Tokugawa chats, 'You're not a bat, you're a peasant.'
Tokugawa chats, 'A smelly, rag ridden peasant.'
Tokugawa chats, 'Now pick your potatoes.'
Tulmyn chats, 'Can I use my inferno to cook the entire field at once?'
Tokugawa chats, 'Peasants dont have inferno.'
Tokugawa chats, 'You have floppy hats.'
Tokugawa chats, 'And speak with a draawl.'
Thecreator chats, 'Ok. I'll be a peasant during day, and make rag my bitch at night.'
Tokugawa chats, 'Ok.'
Ragnar chats, 'Aye, but I do, so I, as I'm older than tok here, am the emporer, lord, king, queen, whatever you like. Unfortunately, tul and symon are now slaves, but there my slaves so how bad can it be.'
Ragnar chats, 'Hello all.'
Ragnar chats, 'Hope you all die.'
Ragnar chats, 'Where's kavr.'
Ragnar chats, 'Kavir too.'
Tokugawa chats, 'No you're a peasant too Ragnar.'
Tokugawa chats, 'Sorry.'
Think I could pass it off as an RPI?
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