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Old 12-16-2004, 09:42 AM   #1
lckychrmsrr
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I have been looking for a new mud for a few months now and can't seem to find one that quite suits my tastes. I don't really have specific requirements such as classless/leveless systems but would like something with Pk. I am looking for an RPI MUD (no MUSHes) and would like your suggestions on what to go check out.

Please do not recommend...
1) SOI
2) Arm
3) or any game that isn't free to play

I look forward to seeing what all is out there that I haven't discovered.
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Old 12-16-2004, 01:04 PM   #2
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You didn't forbiddened to mention so it should be mentioned. There is very good atmosphere, and real Roleplayers do like that place.
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Old 12-16-2004, 03:41 PM   #3
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I'll second Harshlands. Though I've never played there religiously, I did enjoy the time I spent there. Check it out...

Shattered Kingdoms is also a pretty solid game.
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Old 12-16-2004, 05:20 PM   #4
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Harshlands is the only other RPI that I know of besides the two you mentioned. Maybe you mean RP enforced mud? There are plenty of them. (RPI is a more strict term)

Harshlands is similar to SoI codewise (but with less advanced code in my opinion) but has a completely different setting (including a LOT more religious influences) and a lot less players.

If you want a PK mud, Carrion Fields isn't an RPI but it is RP enforced and focuses very heavily on PK.
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Old 12-16-2004, 05:35 PM   #5
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Everybodies definition of RPI seems to be slightly different these days. And even within that particular area there are a multitude of muds with differing playing styles. Someone who wants RPI might consider that levels is not a roleplay device therefore any game that includes a level system is not for them. So since you were fairly loose in defining your boundries I shall give the game I haunt a shameless plug.

Evarayn has been running less than a year, it is based on entirely original code. Not adapted from another code base or mutated, but built from the ground up. Some people find it hard to adjust to playing there because they prefer the familiar syntax and routines of what they are used to, but many stick it out and become perfectly at home (just think what it was like with your first mud and how foreign it all was). We have a unique skills system and plyers gain points to learn more skills through time in the world - which is a plus for roleplay as you are not forced to spend time hunting things to gain useful skills, instead you can be acting out a scene with a group in  village somewhere.

We are a small world, if you are looking for a large population then evarayn is not for you, but we are building playerbase steadily. Gods are active and IC, we have cities and factions, societies and continents. Sailing ships for travel and beasts you can breed yourself and ride. All needs are provided by other players, cooking, crafting, smithing and repairs. We do have player to player combat, pk is not forbidden but there is expected to be ic reasoning behind it. We're not permadeath, though we do have some interesting penalties from death which effectively weaken you until you attend a renewal ceremony (performed by players who have chosen the sage path)

I won't rave here any more, I could do so for hours! check through our website evarayn.com and read up the histories and information posted. If you think we're what you are looking for come on by and try it. It won't cost you a cent, even if you don't think it is what you are looking for come by and try it, you never know until you do
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Old 12-17-2004, 01:50 PM   #6
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My impression is that "RPI" is jargon- it's a term invented by people with a certain style of game to describe their own style of game.  It's no more instructive than going to the grocery store and seeing "New and Improved" or "Deluxe".

There are a lot of games where the method and goal involves good roleplaying, and where roleplaying is required of all players.

We fit the bill of what you ask for in your original post- we're 100% free to play (no "pay-for-perks" or similar systems which amount to "you can play for free as a second-class citizen"), we require roleplay from all players, we have PK, etc.  We're a well-established MUD- up since 1994, with a large and diverse playerbase.

is an ad from the summer describing our basic philosophy and perks.   is a more focused ad, which 'zooms in' on our thief class (one of 16).  Check both out (macrocosm and microcosm), and see if anything there interests you.
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Old 12-17-2004, 06:56 PM   #7
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The point of RPI is to a term for a certain style of game. It is a game that focuses on roleplaying above all else, including PK, level-gaining and getting your character uber 1337.

In an RPI, people are shown by descriptions not names that are somehow mysteriously known. There are no levels or experience points. People don't mysteriously pop back when they die. When you die you make a new character. Character's have to go through an application process before being created. There are no global channels(except maybe a newbie channel, I think). RPIs are sort of like the hardcore roleplaying games. Somepeople like them some people don't.

Nowhere have I said that RPIs are "better" than other RP enforced muds. They are a more specific type of mud and some people may like them while others may not. Some people might like the immersion into the world created by an RPI. Some people might not like not being able to go around killing mobs, players, or gaining levels. Some people might not like righting character applications. And some people might just not like the extensive amount of RP that is involved.

It is a term that is used to help people identify the type of Mud it is not saying that it is better or "new and improved". In my previous post I even recommended Carrion fields. It is not an RPI, but that doesn't mean it isn't good or that it isn't RP required. But somebody who likes playing RPIs, might not like Carrion fields and will probably leave annoyed when their character keeps getting PKed or when people they kill come back to life. Other people might like the adrenaline rush provided by PK and love Carrion fields.

RPI muds are a type of mud. They are in no way "better" or "worse" than other RP muds except in people's opinions. If an RP enforced mud were, RPIs would be apples. Some people might like apples better than oranges but this doesn't mean one is "better". Even though neither is "better" a distinction still needs to be made so somebody doesn't bite into an apple thinking it is an orange or bite into an orange thinking it is an apple.

edit: Evarayn is not an RPI, just wanted to clear that up. (it doesn't have permadeath, has experience points I think, and has an OOC channel, etc.) This doesn't mean is a bad mud, as I said before.

Also, Evaryn is "pay for perks", so they aren't 100% free.
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Old 12-19-2004, 12:41 AM   #8
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This is from Wiki-Pedia
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Old 12-19-2004, 03:33 PM   #9
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Old 12-19-2004, 10:04 PM   #10
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MUD is a general term (at least to me). Its a text base game that has a heavy code presence, lots of coded items, rooms, etc. MUSH is another general term. Its usually light on code, rooms, and items, and alot of time people don't even use coded combat but rather emotes.

Then there are subclasses like RPI mud, H&S mud, Rp-encouraged, sex mud, etc. Each has various definitions and its really up to the person viewing to decide.

But for the most part, RPI muds have a very definitive look and feel to them. Putting such an emphasis on roleplaying as to require character applications to control the type of characters (usually to preserve the games environment, keep characters semi-permanent in their appearance, and prevent description silliness). There is usually few 'numbers' (like no damage numbers, no skill numbers, no levels, etc.).

Anyways, there is a big difference in my opinion between RP-encouraged/enforced/required muds and RPI muds like Harshlands, Armageddon, Fourlands, Southlands, SoI, etc. And I feel that wiki-pedia has done a good job expressing the common meaning of the different terms, at least from what I've heard from other players.
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Old 12-20-2004, 04:34 AM   #11
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MUSH isn't just a term - it's the name of a derivative. MUSH is derived from TinyMUD, just like Merc is derived from Diku, and they all belong to the MUD genre.

To quote Dr Richard Bartle (author of the original MUD) concerning the usage of the term 'MUD':



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Old 12-20-2004, 03:55 PM   #12
 
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According to Tychepedia, any idiot can edit a Wikipedia entry and they often do. Time to fix it. ;-)


p.s. There, is that better?

I was going to add RPI players tend to be extraordinarily anal-centric, unimaginative and highly annoying hobbitses, but I figured they didn't want opinions no matter how highly considered.
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Old 12-20-2004, 08:25 PM   #13
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Old 12-21-2004, 01:41 AM   #14
 
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I'd suggest they be younger than your typical role-player and older than your typical hack-n-slahser, but then that's such a relative term and a broad generalization. Tweeners on the role-playing spectrum.

Some consider that Intensive part immature. It's also a false conceit when better role-play occurs elsewhere. Only in an RPI will one be forced to role-play for the enjoyment of the objects, mobiles and hidden staff. Such is not the way of other role-players who role-play for the entertainment of their fellow players and themselves. RPI is role-play for the hopelessly left-brained and the tragically Diku-centric mud universe, IMNSHO.

There's more than enough. There's a reason it's the smallest segment of even the role-playing population.
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Old 12-21-2004, 07:44 AM   #15
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Old 12-22-2004, 12:55 AM   #16
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There really is an elitism among "RPI" players, at least as expressed on TMS' forums.

I don't disagree with you at all in asfar as this genre appeals to some players and not others.  It's not the kind of game I personally prefer to play, but I can respect what's been created on the better works of the genre for the quality games they are.

Everyone thinks the game they choose to play is the best.  It's just the way of things.  The difference, I think, is that RPI players tend to project this opinion that the fact that they choose to play an RPI makes them more mature or adult than players who choose a differing style of game.  Whereas, for example, a H&S mudder will tend to think he has the better or more fun game, but he won't call you a child, immature, or socially deficient for preferring something else.
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Old 12-22-2004, 01:24 AM   #17
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Well - you do realize that this is precisely my point, yes?

"I dislike members of group X because they all stereotype members of group Y."

If you're going to make blanket statements like that accusing a group of elitism you may as well be honest enough to admit that in the process you're doing pretty much the same thing.

I'm sure there are players in group X who do stereotype members of group Y - but there're also plenty of them who don't.

This is why stereotypes really have no place in reasoned discussion. If you're going to get up on a soapbox and disparage someone else for using them, do be careful that you aren't using them yourself.

I've heard that shoepolish doesn't have a very pleasant taste.
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Old 12-22-2004, 09:04 AM   #18
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Old 12-22-2004, 11:30 AM   #19
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My original point was this:

There are a lot of games where the method and goal involves good roleplaying, and where roleplaying is required of all players.

RPI is one style of this. It isn't the only way to roleplay, and depending on your personal tastes it may not be the best way to roleplay.

For example, I think the games in the genre tend to over-focus on tedious tasks like preparing food, repairing worn armor, etc, and that this focus takes away from roleplay by forcing the player to spend a lot of time on these sorts of tasks. To go back to my novel-writing analogy, a story involving travel doesn't pause to describe the main characters preparing their food every time that realism dictates they would have eaten. It occurs "off camera", but most RPI engines don't allow this- you're forced to go through the motions each time, learn skills related to these tasks, gather ingredients, or suffer starvation.

Our approach is to push that kind of activity away from the foreground, precisely so the player can focus on more interesting things- adventure, storytelling, etc. You need to purchase food and eat, but we don't want to make a big production about it, so it's relatively easy.

Now, we keep food/hunger in the game because we feel like you can do cool things with it:
- certain abilities can inflict hunger
- thieves can steal, poison, and re-plant food onto unwary victims
- woodsy types can often locate food in preferred terrain
- certain foods come with extra benefits
- an especially lightweight and nourishing stash of food can serve as a minor 'treasure' in an area
- etc.

But the important thing is that these cool things aren't burdened by a lot of the things that we feel would slow the game down. Some people like the detail of a system that goes through all the motions, and plays more like a simulation. Other people like our way of abstracting it because they see it as distracting to other elements of the roleplay process- and also because the time we would be spending implementing food preparation is spent implementing quests, battles, spells, etc.

Saying that one style is "roleplay intensive" and the other, by default, isn't... strikes me as labeling, much like my aforementioned example of "deluxe". It's two styles of achieving the same goal.
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Old 12-23-2004, 04:12 AM   #20
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My opinon of it is that the "intensive" part of it is from going into the detail of playing out those mundane things that you say "slows the game down" and detracts from what you say is the most important part of it.

The "intensive" part, in my opinion is having to incorporate those "mundane" things into your rp and have to incorporate the fear of permanent death into it as well. Having to constantly make those emotions, physical needs and such a real part of your character where in others that lack this...you do not.

That is my opinion of it.
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