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Old 09-22-2002, 03:05 PM   #21
Dulan
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Re: SimuBubba

You admit to being biased. And you have....4 posts.

Should I even bother to say the obvious comment?

Heh. I know. In Soviet Russia, Bias owns YOU!

-D
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Old 09-22-2002, 03:09 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
You admit to being biased. And you have....4 posts.
I'm biased because I'm the Producer of the game that made the claim, thanks.

I have 4 posts because, in case you haven't noticed, we're new to this site. You have to start somehwere. ::shrug::
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Old 09-22-2002, 04:43 PM   #23
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Heh.

In Soviet Russia, Newbies post YOU?

No! No! In Soviet Russia, PtP MUDs own YOU!

Hmm. There's got to be a better ISR comment here. I just can't think of it.

But, my point with the ISR comments - You admit to being biased on this subject. You stand to gain something from this subject. You have been posting, what, 1 day? If I have to complete this thought for ANYONE, they need a severe beating.

-D
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Old 09-22-2002, 04:47 PM   #24
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Yep. Bubba sprang out fully grown from under a rock and proceeded to post here.

He's one sick puppy.

But, to add to the thread...isn't all advertising "bragvertising?" How could it not be?
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Old 09-22-2002, 05:10 PM   #25
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I'm biased because I'm the Producer of the game that made the claim, thanks.
Solomon, you crack me up.
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Old 09-22-2002, 05:12 PM   #26
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Bubba might be one sick puppy, but he tries to tell it like it is.

We nub heem! ;D
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Old 09-22-2002, 05:27 PM   #27
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Quote:
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SimuBubba wrote:
Show me another single persistant world that's been around longer than GemStone.
Firstly, Gemstone III isn't "persistant". Secondly, in terms of duration it only went live in 1995 - and there are numerous muds which have been around longer than that. You might then argue that the original Gemstone went live in 1987 - to which I would point out that the original MUD appeared in 1978, and MUD2 is still around (at mudII.co.uk 23).
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Old 09-22-2002, 06:59 PM   #28
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Please please..before we all decide to argue which MUD came first online, let us all at least bow our heads in respect for the one mass selling, over the counter text based game that made someone, somewhere go "Hrm..if we put this on the internet and tweaked the code where more than one persons could play..."
Yes..that game was (and is)
Zork

all bow your heads in respect for the grand-daddy of textbased consumer buyable games Zork..

...ok..you may no continue your "Who was here first" discussion...oh and anyone can pay off some MUD Zine to print "This is one of the hottest MUDs around.."..movie studios do it for their movies so why cant some Imp?
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Old 09-22-2002, 07:41 PM   #29
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Zork was inspired by ADVENT (as was MUD, in case you're interested).
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Old 09-22-2002, 08:35 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
Firstly, Gemstone III isn't "persistant".
Why's that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by
Secondly, in terms of duration it only went live in 1995 - and there are numerous muds which have been around longer than that.
Sorry, that's not correct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by
You might then argue that the original Gemstone went live in 1987 - to which I would point out that the original MUD appeared in 1978, and MUD2 is still around (at mudII.co.uk 23).

Again, I have yet to say that GS was the FIRST MUD.

The world of GemStone I, II, and III is, no matter if you like it or not, the longest running persistant world at the moment.

Now...there is some dispute of this as there IS a game currently running in Japan. I believe. that claims to be a few months older, but neither us nor them are exactly sure.
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Old 09-22-2002, 08:37 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
Zork

Ugh....when someone says "It's dark!" I still ALWAYS say "You might be eaten by a grue."....the SAD thing is, there are people who say "Huh?" and look at me funny.


They have no idea what they missed.
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Old 09-22-2002, 08:43 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by (SimuBubba @ Sep. 22 2002,8:35 pm)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
You might then argue that the original Gemstone went live in 1987 - to which I would point out that the original MUD appeared in 1978, and MUD2 is still around (at mudII.co.uk 23).

Again, I have yet to say that GS was the FIRST MUD.

The world of GemStone I, II, and III is, no matter if you like it or not, the longest running persistant world at the moment.

Now...there is some dispute of this as there IS a game currently running in Japan. I believe. that claims to be a few
months older, but neither us nor them are exactly sure.
And this, folks, is why the community dislikes P2P MUDs so much. Still, I have to give Bub some credit - he manages to completely ignore the entire point of the post in which he quoted and responded to.

-D
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Old 09-23-2002, 04:14 AM   #33
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> > Firstly, Gemstone III isn't "persistant".
>
> Why's that?

If I kill a monster and bury the corpse, then come back a year later, will it still be there (perhaps as a skeleton)?  Or will it have mysteriously vanished?  If I toss a key into the river, will it stay there (rusting) until someone find it - or will it simply vanish?  If I purchase a pie from the baker, does he have to bake a new one - or does another one simply appear in his inventory?  If I kill the baker, does he stay dead - or does he mysteriously reappear out of thin-air a short time later?  The former is a persistent world, while the latter is what Martin Keegan refers to in his article "A Classification of MUDs" as a Groundhog Day system (or a gradual restocking system), and is the typical approach used by most muds.

> > Secondly, in terms of duration it only went live in 1995 -
> > and there are numerous muds which have been around
> > longer than that.
>
> Sorry, that's not correct.

On July 17th 1995, Simutronics announced that it would be offering games through AOL and Prodigy.  On October 19th 1995, Simutronics announced the opening of Gemstone III on AOL.  Gemstone II had been running on Genie previously to that, and the original Gemstone went alpha in 1987 - the same year that Simutronics was founded.

> > You might then argue that the original Gemstone went
> > live in 1987 - to which I would point out that the original
> > MUD appeared in 1978, and MUD2 is still around (at
> > mudII.co.uk 23).
>
> Again, I have yet to say that GS was the FIRST MUD.

You've said that it is the longest running mud.  It is not.  MUD2 has been running for longer, being the derivative of MUD, which was created in 1978 - and thus predating Gemstone by 9 years.
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Old 09-23-2002, 04:18 AM   #34
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Just admit it.

Kavir's knowledge of MUD history > Everyone else's
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Old 09-23-2002, 07:52 AM   #35
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KaVir, in your quote from the Timeline (I have it bookmarked too!, you point out plainly that GS started in 1987 when Simutronics was first formed. It wasn't an alpha or beta, and was in fact "live."

It was also a pay-to-play even then, at an hourly rate, plus the GEnie usage fees and any applicable long distance charges (since GEnie didn't have a local dial-up number in ever city in the world).

It became GSIII once it was introduced on AOL, because the license to use the old RoleMaster base from Iron Crown Enterprises was no longer available and they had to revamp. But it was transitioned over fully, and never left Simutronics' control.

Persistent, if I'm understanding Bubba correctly, refers only to that. That the world was persistently in existence, meaning, it did not shut down for a year while a new owner took over.

-Former GS Player who only clarifies and offers no opinion on the game itself
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Old 09-23-2002, 10:44 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jazuela wrote:
It became GSIII once it was introduced on AOL, because the license to use the old RoleMaster base from Iron Crown Enterprises was no longer available and they had to revamp.
I've been doing some more research, and it looks like it changed name quite a long time before it moved over to AOL:

http://216.239.51.100/search?....e=UTF-8


"In April of 1988, GemStone II went live on that service. GSII had a few problems though, so a few years later in February 1990 Simutronics released GemStone III. That makes GemStone III eleven years old."
-- Llearyn, producer of Gemstone III

However that still doesn't make it the longest running mud.  Nanvaent opened to the public in September 1989, and is still running.  DragonMud opened in december 1989, and is still running.  MUD2 opened in 1985, and is still running.  Federation opened in 1989, and is still running.  Even if you count the original GemStoneI date of 1987, it's still two years younger than MUD2 (which in turn was developed from the 1978 "MUD1").
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Old 09-23-2002, 03:19 PM   #37
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I don't care what y'all say! My daddy can whop your daddy!


~Craig
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Old 09-23-2002, 04:30 PM   #38
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When I wrote up the blurb for GemStone III I actively made an effort to "brag" in a truthful manner.  If I am wrong, I am more than willing to change the blurb, because I really dislike false advertising.

"the largest and longest running massively multiplayer text-based game ever"

Is there a text-based game larger than GS3?  I meant in terms of population ... though I suppose that could be clarified.

Is there another massively multiplayer text-based game that has run longer?  There aren't a whole lot of massively multiplayer text-based games out there.  Again, I'll be happy to change it or reword it.

Being truthful really *IS* very important to me, and I thank you all for your help.

Melissa Meyer
Producer, GemStone III
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Old 09-23-2002, 05:26 PM   #39
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Not that my word's of any value around here <grin>...

But as someone who USED to play GS, had some serious issues with it, and with Melissa at one point,I will attest to her desire to be honest.

If she says she will change the ad if it turns out to be inaccurate, then you can bet on it. And if she says she has no knowledge that it is inaccurate, you can bet on that too.

And now I'll go back to my private griping about GS and the senior staff, which none of you will have the privilege to hear about because it's nonya bidness.
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Old 09-24-2002, 05:34 AM   #40
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Is there a text-based game larger than GS3? I meant in terms of population ... though I suppose that could be clarified.
The Simutronics games have the largest populations of any text-based mud, as far as I know. I wasn't contesting that point.

Quote:
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Is there another massively multiplayer text-based game that has run longer?
You mean "mud", I assume. Yes, there are, and I've pointed them out already.

Note also that my post wasn't a specific attack on your mud, but rather a comment in general on all the commercial muds which appeared on the listings, making all sorts of claims in their descriptions.
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