[depletion]

i was checking it out, read some material on it seemed like an addictive game great features etc, but the playerbase seemed to be lacking??? i notice the content was very good, seemed to me alot of things to do, expecially for new players.Yet the playerbase seems to be set around 100-150 people now.Is the lack of players on mud based games declining? perhaps someone can give me some insight thanks

[scandum]

MUDs are obviously a dying genre.

Google Trends: zmud

[Zivilyn]

Lol, didn't we have this discussion in 1996 Scandum?

I think we're actually on the way up!
Google - Mud Games

[Hephos]

Originally Posted by Zivilyn Lol, didn't we have this discussion in 1996 Scandum?

It has been dying for a long time? :P

[Lasher]

Originally Posted by scandum MUDs are obviously a dying genre. Google Trends: zmud

You may or may not be right, but I don't think this particular graph represents anything other than interest in zmud itself. A number of factors at play there:

• Since 2004 many muds have developed custom clients and promote/favor them.
• Whatever your personal opinion of the cmud/zmud move and the former "lifetime license" on zmud, I'd imagine it did cause at least some number of users to move to other options.
• Mushclient and other clients going open source/free.
• Java, Flash and other web based clients became more standard - may be enough for players who just want a basic interface / access to play.
• Although there's not enough data for it to appear on a google trends graph, I'd also imagine some of the users who previously searched for 'zmud' now search for 'cmud'.

Numbers are down on a lot of the bigger muds since the 2004/2005 period but across all the MUDs out there that is much harder to quantify, particularly as we get into blurring the line between traditional "text based" MUDs and those games that are essentially muds with a few graphics and/or their own client that is the only way to play the game.

On a more positive note, we've seen a lot of WoW players returning recently - it's getting harder for the more casual players to justify that monthly subscription with how the economy is and all that.

[Zivilyn]

Originally Posted by Lasher On a more positive note, we've seen a lot of WoW players returning recently - it's getting harder for the more casual players to justify that monthly subscription with how the economy is and all that.

We've seen that too Lasher, new players even from the WoW world, and old players returning. Apparently it's hard to get the 'depth' of gameplay that some want, in the graphical only world.

[scandum]

Originally Posted by Lasher You may or may not be right, but I don't think this particular graph represents anything other than interest in zmud itself.

You've got a point there, not to mention that I continued the development of TinTin++ in 2004 which is currently getting 1700 downloads a month. Mushclient is a pretty big fish as well. I personally don't think the web based clients are a big threat, the users who use those are probably the same ones who'd have stuck with telnet in the old days.

The 'mud client' search used to be on trends, but is now gone, so I guess general interest for that search has dropped below the inclusion threshold. The 'mud games' trend is sporadic and lower than zMud's. Comparing the trend for zmud vs mushclient it looks like zMud still dwarves all other clients.

Originally Posted by Lasher On a more positive note, we've seen a lot of WoW players returning recently - it's getting harder for the more casual players to justify that monthly subscription with how the economy is and all that.

Not to mention that WoW doesn't cater well to the exploring and socializing player types. Pay for perks MMORPGs are gonna be the next big thing though, and I think we all know that doesn't bode well for muds.

[Burrytar]

Searches for "text game" and "text games" have a consistently strong, stable showing compared to "mud game" or "mud games". I think it's just the term "mud" that has died.

[Lasher]

Originally Posted by scandum Not to mention that WoW doesn't cater well to the exploring and socializing player types. Pay for perks MMORPGs are gonna be the next big thing though, and I think we all know that doesn't bode well for muds.

Many things don't bode well for MUDs, haven't for years now, but we seem to hang in there. There's a certain feel or intimacy that is just hard to replace in other formats. Maybe I'm just like the 80 year old who still prefers black and white movies because that's what they grew up with, but there's plenty of us still out there.

Isn't it sad that we hear email is already "not cool" with teenagers because they would all rather text, yet text games are declining. There has to be an opportunity here. Alas I fear I'm too old, tired, busy, uncool, <insert others> to make it happen myself, but the next "huge" MUD will likely be one that does.

[the_logos]

Originally Posted by Lasher Isn't it sad that we hear email is already "not cool" with teenagers because they would all rather text, yet text games are declining. There has to be an opportunity here. Alas I fear I'm too old, tired, busy, uncool, <insert others> to make it happen myself, but the next "huge" MUD will likely be one that does.

I've had two different venture capital firms offer me seed investments of half a million or so to try making text games on cell phones and at one point a public company was trying to buy Iron Realms in order to launch mobile text games in China.

I turned down the investments both times (though, granted, partly because I was in the midst of raising a lot more than that for Sparkplay) and we couldn't come to acceptable terms regarding a sale because I fundamentally do not believe that there's a large market for text MUDs on cell phones either in China or in the West.

I think that trying to link texting with an untapped desire to play text games on a cell phone is the same kind of mistake that linking kids reading Harry Potter in huge numbers to a desire to play traditional text MUDs is.

Just because they're doing one thing in text doesn't mean that they want to do the other. For instance, just because people enjoy looking at pretty graphics while playing graphical MMOs doesn't mean that these same people are going to spend a lot of time looking at post-modern visual art. Yes, they're both in the visual medium, but that's where the similarities end. Similarly, one might posit that the fact that people spend so much time talking on the phone indicates a desire to play MUDs-by-phone but I think that example mainly serves to demonstrate the flaw in linking interest in activities that take place over a particular medium.

After all, people have been texting each other via IM programs for years, and I don't think that's led to any great influx of MUD players from IM fans.

--matt

[scandum]

I'm not sure what Google is up to, but the zmud query just dropped off of the radar as well. The text games query leads to a website offering a text to speech client for interactive fiction games.

Originally Posted by the_logos After all, people have been texting each other via IM programs for years, and I don't think that's led to any great influx of MUD players from IM fans.

I don't think so either. I assume you've tried advertising outside of the mud community with little success.

Reminds me to go through the user comments of this experiment when I'm bored:

Play Iron Realms, a free online game on Kongregate

[Zeno]

http://zeno.biyg.org/~zeno/tmc_stats/line_graph.php

[the_logos]

Originally Posted by scandum I don't think so either. I assume you've tried advertising outside of the mud community with little success.

Actually, we've been able to bring players in from outside the mud community in fairly large numbers. It is more expensive than bringing players in from within the MUD community, but there are, of course, a LOT more people who haven't played MUDs than who are playing MUDs.

--matt

[Newworlds]

We've had this discussion in no less than 3 other threads in the last year. I honestly don't get it. NW hasn't had a decline in players, if anything it is growing. Perhaps it is our environment and style. Not sure. I do not fear the future at all. In fact, I welcome more competition in graphic games like WoW and Runescape to saturate the market and turn more people back to the Book. It certainly can't hurt.

[scandum]

Originally Posted by the_logos Actually, we've been able to bring players in from outside the mud community in fairly large numbers. It is more expensive than bringing players in from within the MUD community, but there are, of course, a LOT more people who haven't played MUDs than who are playing MUDs.

If the Kongregrate flash client works correctly Achae, Aetolia, Imperian, Lusternia have currently respectively 147, 58, 48, 74 players online.

I guess it must be significantly more expensive to bring in outside players. Have you ever considered advertising at a text based MMORPG like Utopia? Utopia - Home