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Old 12-26-2012, 07:08 PM   #1
Odd Raven
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Opinions: Clients?

I apologize if this was better suited for another forum, but I'm more-so looking for opinions from players, rather than implementation advice!

How does everyone feel about in-website clients? Do you prefer to use an external client like Cmud, Zmud, MUSHClient, et cetera? Or would you rather have a flash/Java client to test out a new MUD on? If you lean towards the latter, what sort of features might be awesome to have in a flash/Java website-based client?

As always, thank you so much for your opinions! I'm always enamored with feedback.
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Old 12-26-2012, 09:11 PM   #2
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Re: Opinions: Clients?

Well, I believe in external clients because I am blind. If I had to choose--mushclient, because it quite literally can do anything. You would not want, for example, to code a lua http server in it, but you *could*, so major plus in my book for that. Want to gather statistics on the game you're playing? sure, no problem. Keep an sqlite database of it? np. Etc, etc.

A quick note for you. Flash is 95% inaccessible to the blind. Java, likewise, at least when run in the browser. You might want to look at html5--if blind accessibility of an internet client is on the table, that's needed, and at least for me, html 5 stuff seems to load faster. Most screen readers have some support for ARIA, and that is continuing to improve, so...heh. Atm, ARIA is the only way to get screen readers to automagically read new messages on a web page--it's intended to make javax and rich applications accessible (unless I'm mangling the terms. I don't know much about website design.).

You can ignore me if you don't care. I just throw this in wherever it should be thrown in, because I sort of took it upon myself to advocate for this in these communities. If your game has regular client access, you're good anyway, so it doesn't much matter.
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Old 12-26-2012, 09:30 PM   #3
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Re: Opinions: Clients?

Quote:
Originally Posted by camlorn View Post
Well, I believe in... ...much matter.
This is GREAT feedback, thank you, Camlorn! It's actually something that I wouldn't have considered if you hadn't brought it up. Honestly, we like to encourage players to be involved with our website and I seem to get the question from new players who are new to MUDs often what client should they play on--or, God forbid, they come in on Telnet.

The MUD is absolutely accessible by any client currently, though, so this would be mostly to promote growth, as we are always interested in that. Thank you again, Camlorn! I always enjoy hearing from you.

Last edited by Odd Raven : 12-26-2012 at 09:38 PM. Reason: Because area =/= are.
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Old 12-27-2012, 05:26 AM   #4
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Re: Opinions: Clients?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Odd Raven View Post
How does everyone feel about in-website clients?
I think they're a good way to lower the entry barrier for newbies, it allows them to get into the game immediately without needing to download and install anything first.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Odd Raven View Post
Do you prefer to use an external client like Cmud, Zmud, MUSHClient, et cetera?
Yes, I mostly use MUSHclient, Mudlet and TinTin++, and BlowTorch when playing from my phone or tablet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Odd Raven View Post
Or would you rather have a flash/Java client to test out a new MUD on?
If it offered some interesting features I'd try it out, but (like most mudders) I feel more comfortable using the clients I'm already familiar with.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Odd Raven View Post
If you lean towards the latter, what sort of features might be awesome to have in a flash/Java website-based client?
The same sort of features that I'd like to see in a desktop client - graphics (energy bars, maps, icons, avatars, buttons, etc), sound, clickable text, extended colours, unicode fonts, etc.
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Old 12-27-2012, 10:41 AM   #5
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Re: Opinions: Clients?

Disregarding my preferences for a moment, I'd imagoine the most growth would be seen with a mobile phone client of some sort. A website can serve this purpose, of course, but a client that is optimized for phones and advertized as such--especially if it hides the mudness behind some sort of graphics a bit--would probably get you more non-mudding folks. And, if that's done as a web site, you could probably design it to work on pcs, too.
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Old 12-27-2012, 11:34 AM   #6
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Re: Opinions: Clients?

Quote:
Originally Posted by KaVir View Post
I think they're a good way to... ...extended colours, unicode fonts, etc.
Thank you, Kavir! That's the sort of feel I was trying to look out for. I was introduced to MUDs via just such a client and eventually traded up to Zmud and MUSHClient. We want to expand our playerbase, so it's important for us to offer players new to mudding (and veterans to the concept) an easier way to check out the game without getting stressed out with too many technical aspects.

I agree on the graphics--when you're adjusting to the idea of a text-based game, it helps to have some of the things you're at least used to from other types of games.

[EDIT: I just followed the link you offered--that looks way past cool. Definitely going to look into that and will hopefully talk to you more about it soon!]

Quote:
Originally Posted by camlorn View Post
Disregarding my preferences... ...work on pcs, too.
As always, good feedback. I, personally, have a phone that is rarely capable of calling people and being a calculator, let alone mudding, but I do understand that smartphones are all the rage these days and we do need to cater to that portion of the playerbase. I know we're compatible with certain clients for phones now, but I need to inspect it a little more. Thanks!

Last edited by Odd Raven : 12-27-2012 at 11:37 AM. Reason: Expressing delight in Kavir's brain
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Old 12-27-2012, 01:25 PM   #7
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Re: Opinions: Clients?

Well, the thing with the smartphone is this. You sort of have to design specifically for it. You can't design a pc client that just happens to run on a smartphone, though it is argueably possible to go the other way. Players, for example, aren't going to want to type long commands, not unless they have a bluetooth keyboard--integrated keyboards seem to be increasing in rarity: why add it if all we have to do is offer one on the touchscreen.

The graphics. I don't think people will "adjust". Games have moved on from mudding, and muds haven't really moved forward. I think some will, but a majority of people won't suddenly switch to a text-based interface and give up the graphics. This is probably a good thing for your specific game: there aren't other similar options for those who like it.
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Old 12-28-2012, 02:49 AM   #8
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Re: Opinions: Clients?

I don't like flash clients because it's a heavy download each time that you clear your cache (correct me if I'm wrong) and the RAM requirements are much higher (MUSHclient: 13mb, Firefox window with just this site, 173 mb).
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Old 01-02-2013, 09:47 PM   #9
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Re: Opinions: Clients?

I use RosMUD when I'm quickly checking out a MUD for the first time, unless there is a stand-alone MUD client for the game. If I get into a game, I switch to Portal GT or MUSH Client.
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Old 01-04-2013, 02:19 PM   #10
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Re: Opinions: Clients?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ForgottenMUD View Post
I don't like flash clients because it's a heavy download each time that you clear your cache (correct me if I'm wrong) and the RAM requirements are much higher (MUSHclient: 13mb, Firefox window with just this site, 173 mb).
No, you're absolutely correct, ForgottenMUD--it is a considerable download after it's been cleared. Mostly, we're looking to open up accessibility, rather than provide a full alternative to the MUD clients everyone loves. This is a very good point to bring up, though. Thanks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by dark acacia View Post
I use RosMUD when I'm quickly checking out a MUD for the first time, unless there is a stand-alone MUD client for the game. If I get into a game, I switch to Portal GT or MUSH Client.
I haven't heard of RosMUD, so I'll have to look into that. I was thinking about steering towards something like Kongregate, but I'm still hugely open for suggestions. Thank you!
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Old 01-07-2013, 01:27 AM   #11
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Re: Opinions: Clients?

RosMUD is fairly basic and works well enough for quickly visiting a new MUD. I used to use AL Client back when I first started MUDding, but it has fewer features.
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Old 01-07-2013, 07:37 PM   #12
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Re: Opinions: Clients?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dark acacia View Post
RosMUD is fairly basic and works well enough for quickly visiting a new MUD. I used to use AL Client back when I first started MUDding, but it has fewer features.
Man, AL Client brings back memories. I think I first started playing Achaea on that, then to Imperian. Thanks for the feedback, as always.
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Old 01-08-2013, 03:51 PM   #13
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Re: Opinions: Clients?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Odd Raven View Post
How does everyone feel about in-website clients? Do you prefer to use an external client like Cmud, Zmud, MUSHClient, et cetera? Or would you rather have a flash/Java client to test out a new MUD on? If you lean towards the latter, what sort of features might be awesome to have in a flash/Java website-based client?
Well, the Top Clients used on NWA are on our website. But to break it down here it is based on the 100+ players on our game:

1. MushClient (about 40% of our players use this).
2. TinTin++ (Very customizable Client and good with Windows and Mac).
2. C and Z MUD (Same company C is the latest version).
4. VipMud (this is a mostly blind player featured client).
5. Ateraan's Website Java Client (I personally HATE java and website clients).
5. Gmud (My personal favorite though only me and a couple people use this anymore).

In it's own category for Iphone and Ipad is:

1. PocketMud Pro (You can find the link on our website. This is a superb client for Iphone and Ipad).
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