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Old 10-26-2004, 12:27 PM   #1
Brody
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During the past six years, we've invited quite a few people on our games at jointhesaga.com to ... how shall I put it? ... seek entertainment elsewhere. Just to spotlight a few:
<ul>
- The guy who couldn't stop shouting "FAGORT!" on our Public discussion channel.
- The guy who kept walking in and out of roleplaying scenes, kicking people for no apparent reason.
- The guy who blew up La Terre.
- The guy who kept ejecting out of starships that didn't belong to him.
- The guy who got assassinated and then embarked on a campaign of truth to bring us all down, rarely to be heard from again while our games prospered.
- Every guy who ever wrote a terrible bio - from the Godfather pimp to Zizu the monster slayer.[/list]
From now until Nov. 3, however, we're opening the doors of our games to these people again. Why would we do such a thing? Why? Simple! For all their faults, none of these people has ever, to our knowledge:
<ul>
- Driven a world superpower into record-setting deficits.
- Launched a war against a country without any evidence that it had done harm or intended harm to the United States, thus creating a chaotic situation in that country so that now there's ample evidence people who dwell there want to harm the United States.
- Imprisoned people without due process.
- Overseen the worst economy since Herbert Hoover.
- Purposefully, repeatedly and stubbornly mispronounced the word "nuclear."
- Suffered difficulty chewing a pretzel to such a degree that they nearly choked on it.[/list]
That's right. None of these people are George W. Bush. For that reason alone, I'm lifting the moratorium for one week only. If players who aren't George W. Bush want to come back into the fold at jointhesaga.com's games - OtherSpace, Chiaroscuro and Reach of the Empire - they're invited to do so. Just log on, create a character and get back into the mix. If a sitelock is in place, drop me a note at wes@jointhesaga.com so I can remove it.

Remember: This offer is only good until Nov. 3. Because, after that, if all goes well, George W. Bush will have all kinds of free time to play MUDs ... and I'll want to let him in too.
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Old 10-27-2004, 02:08 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by (Brody @ Oct. 26 2004,12:27)
- Overseen the worst economy since Herbert Hoover.
It is a shame to see people repeating the above grossly inaccurate statement (started by Hillary Clinton).

That distinction actually belongs to Jimmy Carter. Double digit inflation. Unemployment over 8%. ~20% mortage interest rates (try buying a house with that). 21% misery index (inflation + unemployment). Stagflation - the previously thought impossible combination of negative economic growth and rapid inflation. Waiting in lines on your alloted days to buy gas. Not to mention idiotic moves like giving away the Panama Canal which was a tremendous cash cow as well as strategic asset.

Then look at things currently. Unemployment is currently the same as it was when Bill Clinton got re-elected. Mortgage rates just set another record low this past month. Inflation is basically non-existent.

I'm always disappointed when folks latch on to grossly incorrect propaganda like this, as it detracts from legitimate gripes.
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Old 10-27-2004, 02:42 AM   #3
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[quote= (Threshold @ Oct. 27 2004,02<!--emo&)]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brody,Oct. 26 2004,12:27
- Overseen the worst economy since Herbert Hoover.

It is a shame to see people repeating the above grossly inaccurate statement (started by Hillary Clinton).

That distinction actually belongs to Jimmy Carter. Double digit inflation. Unemployment over 8%. ~20% mortage interest rates (try buying a house with that). 21% misery index (inflation + unemployment). Stagflation - the previously thought impossible combination of negative economic growth and rapid inflation. Waiting in lines on your alloted days to buy gas. Not to mention idiotic moves like giving away the Panama Canal which was a tremendous cash cow as well as strategic asset.

Then look at things currently. Unemployment is currently the same as it was when Bill Clinton got re-elected. Mortgage rates just set another record low this past month. Inflation is basically non-existent.

I'm always disappointed when folks latch on to grossly incorrect propaganda like this, as it detracts from legitimate gripes.
Then I guess it's a good thing this is an advertisement for a game and *not* a political treatise. It's really not, folks - if you mistake it for that after the pretzel comment and any mention of a character named Zizu, then you've got some perspective issues to work out.

Thanks for the concern about my integrity, though - now I know how Jon Stewart felt when he visited Crossfire and got attacked for not being hard-hitting enough with his facts. His response: "The show leading into mine is puppets making crank calls." I've got a game with giant crystalline jellyfish and big reptiles who slurp sewer water as a delicacy. Don't look at an advertising gimmick in the advertising forum of Top MUD Sites and mistake it for a solid attempt at political opining.
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Old 10-27-2004, 05:06 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by (Brody @ Oct. 27 2004,02:42)
I guess it's a good thing this is an advertisement for a game and *not* a political treatise. It's really not, folks - if you mistake it for that after the pretzel comment and any mention of a character named Zizu, then you've got some perspective issues to work out.

Thanks for the concern about my integrity, though - now I know how Jon Stewart felt when he visited Crossfire and got attacked for not being hard-hitting enough with his facts. His response: "The show leading into mine is puppets making crank calls." I've got a game with giant crystalline jellyfish and big reptiles who slurp sewer water as a delicacy. Don't look at an advertising gimmick in the advertising forum of Top MUD Sites and mistake it for a solid attempt at political opining.
Come on now though. That's like saying you could post something advocating slavery and the raping of children and then when someone calls you on it just innocently say, "I was just advertising." I agree with everything you posted about the current administration, but you're dissembling if you claim it was just an advertisement. You pretty clearly were taking a highly partisan position.

I may have agreed with the entire substance of Jon Stewart's statements on Crossfire, but he IS being disingenuous to offer legitimate criticism and then constantly fall back on the, "I'm just a comedian! You can't criticize me!" argument.

--matt
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Old 10-27-2004, 09:10 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by (the_logos @ Oct. 27 2004,05:06)
Quote:
Originally Posted by (Brody @ Oct. 27 2004,02:42)
Come on now though. That's like saying you could post something advocating slavery and the raping of children and then when someone calls you on it just innocently say, "I was just advertising." I agree with everything you posted about the current administration, but you're dissembling if you claim it was just an advertisement. You pretty clearly were taking a highly partisan position.

I may have agreed with the entire substance of Jon Stewart's statements on Crossfire, but he IS being disingenuous to offer legitimate criticism and then constantly fall back on the, "I'm just a comedian! You can't criticize me!" argument.

--matt
It's not just an advertisement. But it's also not posted in a section of this site (or any other) in a format that purports to be serious, legitimate opinion writing. It is absolutely an advertising gimmick, as it was designed to generate discussion/attention/controversy (something we're both pretty familiar with ).

I'm not saying "Don't criticize me, I'm a MU* operator!" I'm saying "Criticize me, if you like. But just keep in perspective that I'm not pretending to offer bulletproof political opinion writing - just trying to advertise my games."
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Old 10-27-2004, 09:18 AM   #6
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<threadjack>
Quote:
Originally Posted by (the_logos @ Oct. 27 2004)
I may have agreed with the entire substance of Jon Stewart's statements on Crossfire, but he IS being disingenuous to offer legitimate criticism and then constantly fall back on the, "I'm just a comedian! You can't criticize me!" argument.
Er, I don't think it's disingenuous at all. He never said he couldn't be criticized, just that the criticism lobbed at him wasn't meaningful. Jon's goal is to be funny. The interview with Kerry was funny. Now if Carlson's criticism was that asking more hard hitting news questions would have been funnier, then he might have had a point. But it wasn't so he didn't.

It was obvious that lobbing the exact same criticisms was simply an ad hominem fallacy of distraction. Saying "We're not wrong because he does something bad too!" does not absolve you of wrongness.
</threadjack>
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Old 10-27-2004, 10:05 AM   #7
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Exactly. Stewart didn't wave his hands and declare he's above it all, but he did say that if CNN wants to turn to a show on Comedy Central for its pointers on journalistic integrity that something's seriously wrong. And he's right. He did such a great service that afternoon, getting on Crossfire and *telling them* they were doing harm to the potential for reasoned debate about these issues.

I don't care which side of the table the Crossfire hosts sit on: They don't do anything but shout and whine at each other, and invite other people to shout and whine with them. It's like Jon said: It isn't debate; it's show business.
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Old 10-27-2004, 06:03 PM   #8
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Don't use modern, RL politics in your post if you don't want to be called to the mat when you say something that is patently false.

Saying "hey, its just an ad" doesn't change the fact that you were indeed expressing a political opinion. A political opinion followed by a joke (and/or preceded by one) doesn't mean it is no longer a political opinion.

Personally, I thought the entire post was in bad taste because modern presidential politics does not belong in this forum in any shape or form. I'm so sick of this election right now it was a real downer to see even TMS get polluted by it.

I know I'm not alone in this feeling. At our last annual convention, my players begged me to make a politics channel so the election discussions could go away from the other OOC channels. They're sick of it, I'm sick of it, and I imagine a lot of folks here are sick of it too.

The main reason I'm sick of it is all the outright lying going on from all sides. That's why I had to correct that specific statement you made that isn't even in the same area code as the truth.
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Old 10-27-2004, 06:42 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by (Threshold @ Oct. 27 2004,18:03)
Don't use modern, RL politics in your post if you don't want to be called to the mat when you say something that is patently false.

Saying "hey, its just an ad" doesn't change the fact that you were indeed expressing a political opinion. A political opinion followed by a joke (and/or preceded by one) doesn't mean it is no longer a political opinion.

Personally, I thought the entire post was in bad taste because modern presidential politics does not belong in this forum in any shape or form. I'm so sick of this election right now it was a real downer to see even TMS get polluted by it.

I know I'm not alone in this feeling. At our last annual convention, my players begged me to make a politics channel so the election discussions could go away from the other OOC channels. They're sick of it, I'm sick of it, and I imagine a lot of folks here are sick of it too.

The main reason I'm sick of it is all the outright lying going on from all sides. That's why I had to correct that specific statement you made that isn't even in the same area code as the truth.
Yeah ... there's always so much more valuable discussion fodder on TMS - who's cheating, who's unethical, who's whiny today.

Snap out of it. I like you guys, but it's an ad. You're just giving it more play by responding to it. If you're REALLY sick of it, ignore it. Send me e-mail saying "Bad Brody! Bad Brody!" Unless you're not so sick of it to vent and keep it going...
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Old 10-28-2004, 12:37 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by (Brody @ Oct. 27 2004,18:42)
Yeah ... there's always so much more valuable discussion fodder on TMS - who's cheating, who's unethical, who's whiny today.
That may be true, but as ugly and nasty as this current election cycle is already, having it invade even TMS is all the more depressing.

Furthermore, the statement I specifically took issue with is so horribly false I just couldn't let it go. You know the old adage: if you repeat a lie often enough people start to believe it. If folks just sit quietly when that particular false piece of information gets repeated, people start to think it is true.

Quote:
Originally Posted by (Brody @ Oct. 27 2004,18:42)
Snap out of it. I like you guys, but it's an ad. You're just giving it more play by responding to it. If you're REALLY sick of it, ignore it. Send me e-mail saying "Bad Brody! Bad Brody!" Unless you're not so sick of it to vent and keep it going...
Hey, you're a good guy. I have absolutely no qualms or reservations about giving you or your game more attention. You deserve it.
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Old 10-28-2004, 01:11 PM   #11
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The more I think about it, the more I come to believe the United States election process not only deserves to be mentioned on TMS ... it also deserves its own MUD. After all, neither major party is all that well entrenched in reality .

And, really, as many plots as I've run in my day, I don't think I ever could have dreamed up some of the stuff that's gone on.

Only a few more days...

...I hope.
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