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Old 09-24-2008, 10:47 PM   #1
Parhelion
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Arrow C++, and Python or Pike -- looking for something new

Over the next couple of years, I plan to be working on a major innovation project to showcase different design and programming ideas that I have. Unfortunately, I am not at the experience level where I can just go out and whip up a masterpiece all on my own -- it's a learning experience. It doesn't hurt, however, to start doing my research now.

I'm looking for something to find a stable or in-development MUD codebase/engine that works similar to the way that LP MUDs work (C driver with a LPC mudlib), with the exception that the driver or server runs in C++ (or C, much less preferrably) with a mudlib written in either Python (my first choice) or Pike.

While I do have some moderate experience with C++, I am only just now beginning to pick up Python (alongside a plethora of other scripting, mark-up, and interpreted languages used in game development); nevertheless, if someone knows of an abandoned or early project that I could look at, or even a developed one, I would greatly appreciate it.

(( As an alternative, and something I'm more looking into for my own enjoyment than anything else, I'm also looking to find stable, bare-bones libs that work well with the DGD driver besides the main ones popularly listed. ))


A note to those who are wondering: I am not interested in a CPP-only codebase; what interests me about the driver-lib setup is the way that the lib can be changed on the fly without compiling and the way that builders can interact and work on it with a great deal more freedom than is allowed with MUDs set up to use plain scripting and OLC. Plus, they just make more sense.


P.S. -- Documentation is awesome. People who bother to document are awesome.
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Old 09-24-2008, 11:23 PM   #2
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Re: C++, and Python or Pike -- looking for something new

You should check out NakedMUD. While the Core is in C, almost all of it has been opened up to the Python that it uses for scripting and subsequent programming. The codebase is theoretically at a point where you do not have to touch the C driver at all. You may have to touch it for a few things here and there, or for things that are not good for interpreted languages like Python, but for the most part you can build the entire game sole using Python. Honestly, you could go so far as to not code anything outside of the game, instead building your game solely through in game building/scripting. Might not be the best idea, but it is possible.

NakedMUD is also bare bones more or less. It has OLC, some standard Imm commands, and room based movement. The way it handles 'vnums' is very handy. Essentially you have URLs for rooms/mobs/objects/triggers. Meaning you name a Zone. Then you make a creature within that zone or room.. or whatever. You then reference it with name@zonename. It also support Inheritance for rooms/onjects/mobs. Meaning say all your various goblins have certain characteristics that are common. Simply build a generic goblin prototype, add what you want to it. the when you go to make goblin2.0 you can tell it to inherit data from goblin. You then can modify goblin2.0 from goblin by simply inputting new details, and leave the ones blank that are inherited or something.. in this manner you can ensure all your goblins have they unique goblin abilities. Course that is only an example.

NakedMUD can be found here:

http://homepages.uc.edu/~hollisgf/nakedmud.html

Quote:
Originally Posted by Parhelion View Post
Over the next couple of years, I plan to be working on a major innovation project to showcase different design and programming ideas that I have. Unfortunately, I am not at the experience level where I can just go out and whip up a masterpiece all on my own -- it's a learning experience. It doesn't hurt, however, to start doing my research now.

I'm looking for something to find a stable or in-development MUD codebase/engine that works similar to the way that LP MUDs work (C driver with a LPC mudlib), with the exception that the driver or server runs in C++ (or C, much less preferrably) with a mudlib written in either Python (my first choice) or Pike.

While I do have some moderate experience with C++, I am only just now beginning to pick up Python (alongside a plethora of other scripting, mark-up, and interpreted languages used in game development); nevertheless, if someone knows of an abandoned or early project that I could look at, or even a developed one, I would greatly appreciate it.

(( As an alternative, and something I'm more looking into for my own enjoyment than anything else, I'm also looking to find stable, bare-bones libs that work well with the DGD driver besides the main ones popularly listed. ))


A note to those who are wondering: I am not interested in a CPP-only codebase; what interests me about the driver-lib setup is the way that the lib can be changed on the fly without compiling and the way that builders can interact and work on it with a great deal more freedom than is allowed with MUDs set up to use plain scripting and OLC. Plus, they just make more sense.


P.S. -- Documentation is awesome. People who bother to document are awesome.
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Old 09-24-2008, 11:40 PM   #3
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Re: C++, and Python or Pike -- looking for something new

I think I ran across a mention of NakedMUD a bit ago, but didn't have time to look into it. Thank you for mentioning it and bringing it back to my attention.
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Old 10-03-2008, 04:30 AM   #4
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Re: C++, and Python or Pike -- looking for something new

Bumping this to show my continued interest.

I'd also be open to obscure and/or abandoned projects written in C++ (but not necessarily a two-layer design). I've gotten some good leads so far.
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Old 10-03-2008, 11:50 AM   #5
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Re: C++, and Python or Pike -- looking for something new

Hello, I too highly recommend NakedMUD as it is a great fit for your requirements. As ShadowsDawn mentioned, you barely have to touch C code if you want so it could be a good way for you to learn Python and have fun doing it. The documentation provided with the codebase is better than most I've seen as well, and should get you up and running in relatively no time at all.

To be honest, had C# and the .NET framework not become mainstream by now, I would be using this codebase. Unfortunately, ANSI C is rather outdated by today's standards(see "ancient") and I don't see much use for it anymore besides very low-level applications. And IMHO, C++ is just as bad with the advent of new programming technologies, though many will beg to differ I am sure. You will find however and I see this especially with game programming frameworks(MUD or otherwise) most will stick with C++ simply for legacy code compatibility. It is cheaper for a company to continue using an older language for compatibility reasons than to rewrite all their frameworks from scratch.

For your purposes however, I believe NakedMUD will be an excellent way to learn Python scripting. After you have some basics down of course!
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Old 10-03-2008, 07:09 PM   #6
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Re: C++, and Python or Pike -- looking for something new

Of course.

I have to say I cling to C++ out of familiarity. It's within my "comfort zone."

Thank you for the advice and suggestions.
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Old 10-19-2008, 11:15 AM   #7
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Re: C++, and Python or Pike -- looking for something new

Quote:
Originally Posted by Parhelion View Post
Bumping this to show my continued interest.

I'd also be open to obscure and/or abandoned projects written in C++ (but not necessarily a two-layer design). I've gotten some good leads so far.
If you've gotten leads other than those mentioned in this thread so far, perhaps you might care to mention them?

Cheers.
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Old 10-19-2008, 02:56 PM   #8
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Re: C++, and Python or Pike -- looking for something new

Parhelion, you might want to look at a list of Python codebases I've been compiling. Of special interest would be the Nameless Sorrows mudlib, a stackless framework that could be quite interesting to work with.
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