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Old 07-05-2011, 02:11 PM   #21
Anjanas
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

If you want to play on New Worlds there is no way in hell you will get into a guild with 10 minute spurts of login time. There is a way around this though, become a rogue, I did! Rogues have no guild structure or leadership and can do what they want. You can run around pretty much on your own. Nw is a very serious roleplay place, though, if you can't handle that (which your comments show you can't) you're best off in a happy go lucky hack and slash environment. I'm one of those players that can't stand whiners like you who want us all to baby you through your baby steps of play. If you want to play in the big league you have to grow up. Its why I'm so glad you must be 18 to play on that game. I like to roleplay with men not boys.
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Old 07-06-2011, 05:02 AM   #22
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

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Originally Posted by Anjanas View Post
If you want to play on New Worlds there is no way in hell you will get into a guild with 10 minute spurts of login time.
I think the OP was simply saying that they can't always play for long periods and sometimes come on for 10 minute play times.
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Old 07-06-2011, 09:02 AM   #23
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

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Why do play for 10 minutes and in depth roleplay have to go together? Obviously you can't have 10 minute play time and in-depth roleplay.

What you can have is a game that has in depth roleplay but at the same time allows you to logon and check in game mail or something else for 10 minutes if that is all you have time to do, and not have you forced into a guild scene that takes 3 hours and has you getting in trouble next time you login because you had to log out and go somewhere.

I'm not bitter, I'm not enraged, I fully understand that in a lot of MUDs the immortals have their fingers in something on a player level, least that is from my experience, I just hoped that one would not. Turns out it was just stupidity to think I had found a great MUD that was completely immortal grubby finger free.

I was by no means saying every character in the game should mold to my character, what I WAS saying was that my character should not be forced to mold into someone elses play style, then when I don't, I get stopped playing the game by one of the commands until I mold to how that player wants me.
Thing is Cirion, all those other people who are already playing, at the moment you log in, are already playing. They're already involved in whatever they're involved in. And if your character is known, they might need your character for something. For all you know, they might have been holding up events in the hopes that they would run into your character. And there you are!

But OOOPS sorry everyone, you're there, but you can't interact, so just uhhhh pretend your character isn't there. Even though he is. Because it is inconvenient for you, to be logged into a multi-player interactive game, and actually play the game, as one of multiple players, interactively with each other, for the next ten minutes.

In summary: if you don't have time to RP, then don't log into an RP game. If you do log into an RP game, and there are other PCs around, then don't be surprised, or irritated, if some of them attempt to involve you in the current plotline. That is WHY the game exists.

You might be better off with a first-person shooter, if you find interacting with other players while you're logged into an RP game, to be inconvenient.
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Old 07-06-2011, 09:07 AM   #24
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

Usually by giving a heads up to the rest of the playerbase on the game fourms, (hey, I'm sorry, but RL has me in a royal bind and I can't play as often as I want to. so---), will cover things nicely.

You can be surprised by the number of players that don't, but not surprised by the aggravation that comes as a result.


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Old 07-06-2011, 10:55 AM   #25
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

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Originally Posted by Jazuela View Post
Thing is Cirion, all those other people who are already playing, at the moment you log in, are already playing. They're already involved in whatever they're involved in. And if your character is known, they might need your character for something. For all you know, they might have been holding up events in the hopes that they would run into your character. And there you are!

But OOOPS sorry everyone, you're there, but you can't interact, so just uhhhh pretend your character isn't there. Even though he is. Because it is inconvenient for you, to be logged into a multi-player interactive game, and actually play the game, as one of multiple players, interactively with each other, for the next ten minutes.

In summary: if you don't have time to RP, then don't log into an RP game. If you do log into an RP game, and there are other PCs around, then don't be surprised, or irritated, if some of them attempt to involve you in the current plotline. That is WHY the game exists.

You might be better off with a first-person shooter, if you find interacting with other players while you're logged into an RP game, to be inconvenient.
This stick-up-butt-ness is a real problem for some muds. I don't care how RP-focused a game is supposed to be. Every single mud, like it or not, is a computer game first and a totally immersive fictional world second. If someone is afk, idle, distracted by the real world, or his or her time is limited, it is our place, as courteous human beings, to show common courtsey to our fellow computer game players and work with or around those factors, especially if someone took the time to let us know their situation ahead of time. Why the heck would we even consider telling someone who shares our hobby and our interests, and loves the same game we do, "What do you mean you can only stay on for 30 minutes? Why'd you even bother logging in to such a serious game then?"
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Old 07-06-2011, 02:39 PM   #26
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

I typically play MUDs for irregular hours. 10 minutes here, 4 hours there and everything in between. I never have much trouble regarding RP. Everyone I interact with are understanding that not everyone can be available all the time.

Unless I know I have a dedicated amount of time to get involved with a current plot line; I just try to avoid putting myself in that situation. It still happens occasionally but like I said, everyone is pretty understanding.
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Old 07-08-2011, 01:23 PM   #27
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

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I think the OP was simply saying that they can't always play for long periods and sometimes come on for 10 minute play times.
You sir, get a cookie.
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Old 07-10-2011, 01:22 PM   #28
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

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You sir, get a cookie.
I hope it is one of those gnome cookies from Domplin. Maybe the fire cookie or watermelon flavored!
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Old 07-10-2011, 01:26 PM   #29
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

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This stick-up-butt-ness is a real problem for some muds. I don't care how RP-focused a game is supposed to be. Every single mud, like it or not, is a computer game first and a totally immersive fictional world second. If someone is afk, idle, distracted by the real world, or his or her time is limited, it is our place, as courteous human beings, to show common courtsey to our fellow computer game players and work with or around those factors, especially if someone took the time to let us know their situation ahead of time. Why the heck would we even consider telling someone who shares our hobby and our interests, and loves the same game we do, "What do you mean you can only stay on for 30 minutes? Why'd you even bother logging in to such a serious game then?"


Agreed.

I've experienced this first hand when Unemployment cut into my play time, and in trying to convince the 'other players' that a player I was helping had problems concentrating due to ADHD.

They didn't care either way, it was all just 'Role Playing' to them. And you can guess how that ended.

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Old 07-10-2011, 06:06 PM   #30
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

It's all well and good to call it "stick up the buttness" but when the OP comes here and specifies, in a bullet point,
Quote:
*In depth RP. I want the politics, the religions, the player run government, and all that good stuff that comes with an RP MUD, I just also want the freedom to play what the hell I want to play (within reason), and not interact with anyone I don't want to.
Then he is already declaring, in advance, that HE expects people to adhere to the intensity of an in-depth mud, as long as they don't expect HIM to do the same.

If you want politics, religions, player run governments, then you're also wanting conflict. These things come with conflict. And if you refuse to interact with your character's enemy, solely on the basis that you "don't want to," then you ruin it for that character's player, who probably has taken time out of HIS 10 minutes per day, helping to contribute to the game world by becoming your enemy in the first place.

You want roleplay? Then roleplay. You want to avoid RPing with people you don't "want" to RP with? Then don't expect that people will be lining up at the doors to RP with you.
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Old 07-11-2011, 10:53 AM   #31
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

I don't follow this at all. All the OP is asking for is the same permissions we have in real life.

I have a role I play in real life. I generally don't have to interact with people I don't like unless they have something I want. I can sit in my cave all damn day if I feel the urge and the world will go on without me. There may be consequences to that decision, but my participation is hardly required for time to advance.

I don't really see how the OP's request in a MUD is any different.

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Old 07-16-2011, 12:29 PM   #32
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

It depends upon how the MUD is structured.

If its more Social-Based, then OP needs to get out and about as social interaction is nessicary in more ways than one. But be warry of players who take Socializing a bit too far, as they tend to start power-tripping with Staff Conections--which forces away those who aren't their friends, as I know full well.

If its a Combat-Based, then he can stay in his cave until his Beer and Munchies supply runs low (or the Cable Sports Channel bill needs to be payed), go out and beat/rob as many people as possible before returning back to his cave with fresh supplies and payed bills. In this Game, the Player initiates the action and gets rewarded for it with very little need to socialize.


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Old 07-16-2011, 03:01 PM   #33
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

It's a very tough balance to find. (If anybody finds it, tell me the mud right away!)

A serious roleplaying mud, where players affect things and can get ahead through all kinds of interaction and socializing, but a casual mud where you don't have to be online all day doing this to really be involved, important, and advance.

My biggest problems have been finding decent rp muds, but being a real world person with a real world life and not having the time to play 12 hours a day. So I'm never around for all the big deal special events, and my characters never become important or influential. I just level up in silence, have some mundane chatty rp with a few people I come across, and never amount to anything. All of the influential roles are always eaten up by the people who are online all day long.

I used to be okay just being a regular joe who's around on some weekends, or maybe at odd hours during the week, who dropped in for some casual rp and gaming, but more and more, the better known rp muds have started unconsciously treating these casual players like second-class citizens. Not intentional or overt exclusion, just little things, like not sticking around to rp with that guy you only see once a week because you know it won't really go anywhere and you want to find one of those guys who's online for 12 hours a day like you are to go do something. People don't want to just rp and have fun any more. They want to work hard to build characters that get somewhere and maximize their gains while online. Seriously, get a job! You can get paid for working that hard. I've relegated myself to just playing casual muds with a limited rp scene and making my own rp with interested players that happen along.
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Old 07-16-2011, 10:17 PM   #34
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

I feel you SnowTroll. I often find myself in the same position. I like the RP environment that many MUDs have to offer (in character conversation, well described game world, rational players, rules enforced, and combat that makes sense). But i dislike how in many games that translates into a lot of stuff like multiple written essays, multiple approval processes that could take several real life days or weeks and other time real life commitments that don't translate to "fun" or even add to the immersion. For a person that works hard and is logging in to chill and forget about life for a while and instead be a powerful magician in a fictitious land, it's less of a IC barrier to entry and more like a ooc locked iron door draining the desire to play from anyone that works full time. There are only so many hours in the day.

However, I don't log in with the desire to be important. I just want to play a role that is fitting for my personality. That goes for every RP mud I play in.

It's a tough balance. Many of the non-RP MUDs I just can't get into. My brain just gives up when someone walks up to me saying "wassup dud, this mob is tuff" when I am about to face down a dragon.
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Old 07-17-2011, 01:09 PM   #35
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

Snowtroll and Exohuman my comments here are mostly for you or players that think in this way.

The question is: How come I can't play in a enforced serious roleplay game but have it casual too so I don't have to be around alot to advance or be important?

The answer is similar to a question I was asked once. While attending a concert with an exceptional pianist the person sitting next to me said, "I would give my life to be able to play like him." I answered quietly, "He did."

What I'm saying is that you can't be a professional race car driver and win the race by driving casually a little bit every so often. To be good and indepth and important you have to devote some time to it. That doesn't mean you can't race for fun or drive periodically on the race track and have a good time. Just don't expect to win and don't expect the other racers to suddenly know you and want to interact or listen to your expertise on racing.

Most games (at least New Worlds Ateraan), gives you the opportunity to play casually. There are options to not have to specifically join a guild that requires lots of roleplay. You can drop in and out for a few minutes or an hour every so often, but just like the race car driver, you can't expect to be majorly important in the environment with brief arrivals.

As to the matter of guild joinings and roleplay required to join guilds. After 10 years of administration in serious roleplay gaming, it has been obvious that to have such requirements has bred a better environment for the players that enjoy serious roleplay gaming. It is similar to the movie matinee and the late night (kid's not allowed) movie ticket: You can watch a movie with quiet, respectful persons, or you can watch a movie with popcorn flying, crying, noisy, obnoxious, and distracting persons. You really can't have both.

I hope these comments (while not perfect) help to explain why rp enforced games operate the way they do.
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Old 07-17-2011, 02:29 PM   #36
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

Yeah, I understand and see your point about the guild recruitment being onerous to filter out non-RP players. However, don't you see the irony in the comparison to a master piano player or NASCAR driver? Those are two people who will not be playing a mud that required them to write multiple essays on fiction, interview 7 people and write essays on that, and then go through another interview process just to get the class they want to play in a Mud. Good RP is fine! It's great! It's fun! It's entertaining but an online game should not be requiring the effort a cheap school course might. No offense to New Worlds (it's a great game) but the non-guilded option suffers from being a single class that may not fit the personality of the gamer.

I'm not disagreeing (I agree too that good RP requires a time commitment to the scene), but just pointing out the oddness of it all. I've RP'd for over 13 years now in various games (sometimes creating an RP community in games that had none) and many of them were not MUDs. I used to enjoy the improv-like atmosphere of table top games and even managed to have RP that was meaningful and fun in some of the big graphical mmos. Those were fun times.

However, I would like to kindly say that the requirements I stated in the first paragraph above are not only un-RP, But they lack fun too. Why not send the player on a coded quest that forces him to demonstrate the ideals of the guild to join? Why not have him join the other guild members on a romp through a dungeon specifically created for recruits to learn the ways of the guild? Or have an instance where recruits must learn the skills one by one and get quizzed on the ways of the guild? Initiation rites and rituals existed everywhere all over the world, why not dance around a fire and call the spirits of the ancestors and have those judge his spirit?

Again, people do what they find fun (or endure something less fun in hopes of future fun) but I would kindly like to suggest to any receptive mud implementor with a desire for RP gaming that FUN should be the focus and to keep in mind that other, more important things are going on in the players lives. The player that doesn't like your game will play another one, but seriously, do you want to turn away good players because you bored them or asked things of them that would get them laughed out of a family BBQ for doing without getting paid?
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Old 07-17-2011, 03:39 PM   #37
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

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The question is: How come I can't play in a enforced serious roleplay game but have it casual too so I don't have to be around alot to advance or be important? ...
I hope these comments (while not perfect) help to explain why rp enforced games operate the way they do.
What makes New Worlds the mud it is is the players. You've cultivated a reasonably-sized group of people that are all dedicated to maintaining a game where roleplaying is enforced and is important. It's not the administration, the coding, the building, the setting and backstory, or the rules that make New Worlds what it is. New Worlds is a succesful roleplaying mud because of the players.

Somewhere out there, there might be a mud, kind of like New Worlds in that the players are all dedicated to roleplaying, but where the players are also dedicated to fun first and foremost, and to maintaining a casual playing environment. Where roleplaying is about fun rather than about getting somewhere in the game, and where everyone who logs in, new or old, habitual or casual player, is a potential source of roleplaying and entertainment rather than someone you shouldn't bother with because you're wasting time you could be getting somewhere.

I think it's totally possible to be a "serious roleplaying mud" without going the route where you have to be a "serious player" who plays all day long to fit in. I just haven't found that mud yet. Maybe it doesn't exist.
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Old 07-18-2011, 01:03 AM   #38
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

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I think it's totally possible to be a "serious roleplaying mud" without going the route where you have to be a "serious player" who plays all day long to fit in. I just haven't found that mud yet. Maybe it doesn't exist.
It is not possible for the reasons I stated before. If you have one, you will drive off the other. If you have the other you will drive off the one. You are asking for a ski resort in the desert. While possible, the snow will melt within a few days.
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Old 07-18-2011, 01:06 AM   #39
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

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Good RP is fine! It's great! It's fun! It's entertaining but an online game should not be requiring the effort a cheap school course might. No offense to New Worlds (it's a great game) but the non-guilded option suffers from being a single class that may not fit the personality of the gamer.
Not all guilds are the same. All require a variety of tasks that are different and unique depending on the guild.
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Old 07-18-2011, 01:55 AM   #40
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Re: Let's try this again...RP MUD

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I think it's totally possible to be a "serious roleplaying mud" without going the route where you have to be a "serious player" who plays all day long to fit in. I just haven't found that mud yet. Maybe it doesn't exist.
I think you're looking for something along the lines of my mud philosophy. Not yet fully playable, but I'm just putting those concepts out there.

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