[Shao_Long]

well..
The stupid idea of writing this message came to my head after Seth's words that he left RoD just because he had trouble with immortals..
Then I heard some really good words on TV
'You should not hate your country if your government hates you'

I think this is the case..
if you really loved your mud,you wouldnt left it just because some imm caused trouble for you..look for solution in yourself..And,hey,I hope you'll come back..whenever your home is..


(now dont look at this one as on another of my dumb jokes.This whole message IS COMPLETELY SERIOUS.No dumb 'kinda funny' replies here,oki ?)

[Seth]

Hmmmm.... Well. in essence, I guess RoD is "okay". Basically, the only mistake I made was to turn on this channel called "avatar-chat", which was so full of obnoxious suck-ups and egocentric maniacs that it made the US Senate look like the local establishment of the Salvation Army. Seriously. While I was an avatar on RoD and didn't have avchat on, I was a perfect little player, with the only problem ever up to that point with an immortal being based on an misunderstanding. I felt REALLY bad about it and apologized to the poor guy as soon as I could. I didn't spam back then and I didn't even know what flaming was. Heck, I didn't even know what spamming was for that matter either! Those were my "happy times"... (que theme music from Das Boot here)

However, the channel avchat is so utterly disgusting yet addictive. It's full of people and it's easily one of the most active channels around, beside the regular chat channel. But I got tired of that one because of the constant whining newbies. so I tried avchat and gradually became hated. Why? Because I am too stubborn to suck up and because I taunted those who abused their power. It all escalated into the imms punishing me for everything they could. I once got silenced for a day because I told a friggin' blond joke! It wasn't a sick joke, a perverted one or otherwise offensive. It was just an innocent joke. Avchat was my first mistake.

My second mistake would be a long-distance relationship with a person from RoD. She wasn't even level 50 when I met her, so I helped her level her character up to level 50. We were a happy couple back then, dreaming of the future, with us being together....

It all ended when she became corrupted by the filth and the sycophants on avchat. She made some wrong friends. Friends who thoroughly hated me. They talked her into becoming one of their own, a sycophant. It all happened so quickly and so behind my back, because I was too blind and too in love to see it. To sum it up, my girlfriend dumped me and together with her new "friends", she proceded to try and have me sitebanned.

While her tries initially were unsuccesful, it was only a matter of time before two of the most pwer-abusive immortals on RoD caught wind of it. Kali and Moonbeam. Both were known to ban people simply because they didn't like them. They were also the highest authority concerning players, because the upper level of management at RoD is more concerned with building the SMAUG engine and less with the players. Besides, they were RL friend altogether so it was of no use anyways. I didn't know who was the first to siteban me, but when I was unsitebanned 4 or 5 months later, it was Moonbeam herself who logged on to siteban me again for no reason whatsoever. My characters were stolen, undoubtably they were given away as some sort of trophies by said immortals. My hostmask was banned by someone whose level of power abuse made Saddam Hussein look like a boyscout. My emails to the highest immortals were never answered or replied with in a general "We don't give a f***, we got enough players." way.

This left me a very bitter person.

So to sum things up, I didn't "leave" RoD, tho I did at one point.... For a week... I got sitebanned.

[Shao_Long]

well hey..This seems a very sad story indeed..
Kali and Moonbeam are sure not the best folk to mess up ,thats for sure..
Heh,because of them I even am thinking of idea creating some 'internal security' here
and,hey,i didnt understood maybe..are you still sitebanned from there ?
or you just dont want to come back anymore ?

[Seth]

Guess.

[KaVir]

I'm surprised, Seth; I've known Kali and Moonbeam for years, have never sucked up to them, and yet they've always been polite and friendly to me. Are you sure you're not confusing "too stubborn to suck up and because I taunted those who abused their power" with "verbally harrassing the staff and fellow players"?

I'm sure there was some animosity on both sides, but somehow I highly doubt you're as innocent as you make yourself out to be. I've heard similar accounts to yours about myself, in the past, so I know how these things tend to get highly distorted. However if you take a dislike to an immortal, starting a harrassment campaign against them is going to get you banned on any mud - regardless of how justified you feel your motives are.

[Shao_Long]

hey,you might be right Kavir..
but I noticed that Moonbeam is either not so newbie friendly or she just had bad mood.
Cuz once I have been sending a new social,and asked stuff something like 'how do you think,will it be accepted' or something like that.She told me to shut up and dont bother her..Well maybe that was my mistake ,I usually dont tell such things to imms,but I inquiried,does she has a bad day ? or something like that
well,my char was silenced..heh,nice


But I dont think it proves anything.

Anyways,I just asked one more imm on RoD,about what can someone do if he thinks he was banned not rightly.
Well,you had a lot of possibilties to have your case seen by other imms..I would have done this,thats for sure..

Perhaps you just dont like RoD too much ?

[Shao_Long]

but hey,anyways,
if ya want,I can work on getting you un-banned

the thing is 'if you want' ...

i dont think it will be too much trouble,but you must want it yourself,ya know...

[Seth]

Originally Posted by (KaVir @ May 03 2002,6:12 pm) I'm surprised, Seth; I've known Kali and Moonbeam for years, have never sucked up to them, and yet they've always been polite and friendly to me.  Are you sure you're not confusing "too stubborn to suck up and because I taunted those who abused their power" with "verbally harrassing the staff and fellow players"? I'm sure there was some animosity on both sides, but somehow I highly doubt you're as innocent as you make yourself out to be.  I've heard similar accounts to yours about myself, in the past, so I know how these things tend to get highly distorted.  However if you take a dislike to an immortal, starting a harrassment campaign against them is going to get you banned on any mud - regardless of how justified you feel your motives are.

For the record, I never started an harassment campaign. By the time immortals and other players becan to harass me, I didn't even know what spamming nor flaming ment. Besides, why would I want to harass a person for no reason? An yes, I'm sure i'm not confusing anything right here right now. Keep your opinion objective, otherwise ditch it and put it in the nearest garbage bin because I have seen enough yes-heads and people who go like "Oh my friends don't like him so I better be a shallow moron and start disliking him as well" on RoD already. No flames intended of course.

Secondly, how are you going to decide which story is true then? I mean, if you want to judge about something you have to hear both versions of the story, both sides of the conflict, and then judge about it in an unbiased and objective way, which you can NOT because you already told us you're good friends with 'them'.

[Shao_Long]

Hey Seth..so whaddya think,you want me to try to talk with imms about getting you back ?
I would be really glad to help..

[KaVir]

Originally Posted by For the record, I never started an harassment campaign. By the time immortals and other players becan to harass me, I didn't even know what spamming nor flaming ment.

But you just said in your previous post: "...I tried avchat and gradually became hated. Why? Because I am too stubborn to suck up and because I taunted those who abused their power. It all escalated into the imms punishing me for everything they could".

Even according to your version of what happened, you "taunted" the immortals - and obviously felt justified in doing so.  Even had you been justified, that's still harrassment - and (as I said before) I don't know any mud which would put up with a player badmouthing their staff on public channels.  It makes the mud look bad - like a school where the children are allowed to run rampant.

Originally Posted by Besides, why would I want to harass a person for no reason?

You've already told us.  Because you felt that "avatar-chat" was, and I quote, "so full of obnoxious suck-ups and egocentric maniacs that it made the US Senate look like the local establishment of the Salvation Army".

Originally Posted by An yes, I'm sure i'm not confusing anything right here right now. Keep your opinion objective, otherwise ditch it and put it in the nearest garbage bin because I have seen enough yes-heads and people who go like "Oh my friends don't like him so I better be a shallow moron and start disliking him as well" on RoD already. No flames intended of course.

I do not form my opinions based on the views of others.  I am forming my opinions of this situation based on what you've said and my years of experience handling obnoxious players.  And I'm forming my opinions of you based on your conduct on these boards.  The two are unrelated, although neither would exactly be considered "glowing recommendations".  No flames intended, of course.

Originally Posted by Secondly, how are you going to decide which story is true then? I mean, if you want to judge about something you have to hear both versions of the story, both sides of the conflict, and then judge about it in an unbiased and objective way, which you can NOT because you already told us you're good friends with 'them'.

Have I?  Where have I said that?  At which point did "I've known Kali and Moonbeam for years, have never sucked up to them, and yet they've always been polite and friendly to me" become "I'm good friends with Kali and Moonbeam"?

That is precisely the sort of thing I was referring to when I said "I know how these things tend to get highly distorted".

I have to wonder.  If "they've always been polite and friendly to me" becomes "they're good friends of mine" over the span of 36 minutes, then what did you really say all those weeks/months/however long ago which you're now claiming as "I taunted those who abused their power"?

Because if that had been my mud, and even if you had just sat on my mud and "taunted" my staff, it would have led to an eventual ban.  As I've said before, it makes the mud look bad when the players badmouth the staff, and leads to poor discipline and a general lack of respect from the players.  Believe me, I've been there - I tried letting the players do whatever they liked.  But you can't do it, not if you want to run a successful mud - and RoD has been around more than long enough to have learned those lessons.

However I also have a query regarding another point of yours, specifically "To sum it up, my girlfriend dumped me and together with her new "friends", she proceded to try and have me sitebanned."  Why did she want you sitebanned?  Are you telling me that she suddenly went from loving you to hating you so much she didn't want you around?  You didn't (for example) keep pestering her, after she'd broken it off with you?  I'm sure you were upset at being dumped, and I know (speaking from my own experience) that when it happens you keep thinking that maybe, if you can just persuade her - just talk to her - she'll remember what it used to be like.  But if she says "no", you just have to leave her alone, otherwise you'll just make things worse.  And I know it's natural to want someone to blame - we all do when something like that happens.  But blaming the mud isn't helping anyone, it's just making you look bad.  And yes, I know it sucks - I've been there too - but you've just to to rack it up as "another experience" and get on with the rest of your life.  You're still young yet (in fact I was the same age as you when I went through pretty much the same thing, so I can relate).  A few years from now you'll be looking back and realising that she did you favour.

Regardless of what you do, life goes on.  Make the most of it - we're only mortal in this world

[Shao_Long]

hey KaVir..
thanks for joining my attempts to help Seth,but I tend to disagree with you..
Maybe about first part you were right,maybe.I dont have so much experience or whatever.
But the last part of your statement IS NOT right at all..I've got good examples about it..

For example : One girl really loved one guy (they met on a mud,but i suppose it wasnt just a mud for them.They were really close,even thought never met IRL,and dont worry,they wouldnt be cross if i post this one)
So.One day something went wrong.They were really angry one with other,and especially that guy was..Heh,he said to her to leave him alone,he thought he wanted her to leave.
But she kept 'harassing' him and whaddya think ? I dont think I know happier people now,at least when they're together.
And its not a single example I know.

[Seth]

Originally Posted by But you just said in your previous post: "...I tried avchat and gradually became hated. Why? Because I am too stubborn to suck up and because I taunted those who abused their power. It all escalated into the imms punishing me for everything they could". Even according to your version of what happened, you "taunted" the immortals - and obviously felt justified in doing so. Even had you been justified, that's still harrassment - and (as I said before) I don't know any mud which would put up with a player badmouthing their staff on public channels. It makes the mud look bad - like a school where the children are allowed to run rampant.

I merely openly questioned the deciscions of a certain immortal who is anything but a good friend of you, even though you know her for years and she acts kind and polite to you which is so obviously not a sign of anything but pure hatred. Of course, me being a lowly mortal on a MUD, thus having no real value on any MUD really. Besides, I figure most MUDs are having a "Who cares about one player?"-esque attitude. So why deal with criticism if you can siteban the ****er and hope someone more malleable to your ideas of "fun" comes around?

By the way, can we stop throwing bombs on canadians- err... terrorists please? It mght be justified but it's still harassment according to someone on here.

Originally Posted by You've already told us. Because you felt that "avatar-chat" was, and I quote, "so full of obnoxious suck-ups and egocentric maniacs that it made the US Senate look like the local establishment of the Salvation Army".

Notice the for no reason? bit in my original text? Thank you. Before you start attacking my statements, you might want to read them fully first.

Originally Posted by The two are unrelated

Need I say more?

Originally Posted by Have I? Where have I said that? At which point did "I've known Kali and Moonbeam for years, have never sucked up to them, and yet they've always been polite and friendly to me" become "I'm good friends with Kali and Moonbeam"?

Are you dense? Or does this general "social" thing just really boggle you? I'd say that if you know someone for years and are friendly with them, you're friends. Then again, I could be mistaken and your description of Kali/Moonbeam is your definition of your "arch nemesis".

Originally Posted by I have to wonder. If "they've always been polite and friendly to me" becomes "they're good friends of mine" over the span of 36 minutes, then what did you really say all those weeks/months/however long ago which you're now claiming as "I taunted those who abused their power"?

Come again? What has my opinion got to do with your odd definition of friendship?

Originally Posted by Because if that had been my mud, and even if you had just sat on my mud and "taunted" my staff, it would have led to an eventual ban. As I've said before, it makes the mud look bad when the players badmouth the staff, and leads to poor discipline and a general lack of respect from the players. Believe me, I've been there - I tried letting the players do whatever they liked. But you can't do it, not if you want to run a successful mud - and RoD has been around more than long enough to have learned those lessons.

So, as soon as you get the slightest sign some immortals is being power abusive from a player, you immediatly ban that player fearing SOMEONE might say something bad about your MUD? Nice "Entlösung" you got there mate. I refer to my first paragraph for elaborate details on the way you most likely think.

Originally Posted by However I also have a query regarding another point of yours, specifically "To sum it up, my girlfriend dumped me and together with her new "friends", she proceded to try and have me sitebanned." Why did she want you sitebanned? Are you telling me that she suddenly went from loving you to hating you so much she didn't want you around? You didn't (for example) keep pestering her, after she'd broken it off with you? I'm sure you were upset at being dumped, and I know (speaking from my own experience) that when it happens you keep thinking that maybe, if you can just persuade her - just talk to her - she'll remember what it used to be like. But if she says "no", you just have to leave her alone, otherwise you'll just make things worse. And I know it's natural to want someone to blame - we all do when something like that happens. But blaming the mud isn't helping anyone, it's just making you look bad. And yes, I know it sucks - I've been there too - but you've just to to rack it up as "another experience" and get on with the rest of your life. You're still young yet (in fact I was the same age as you when I went through pretty much the same thing, so I can relate). A few years from now you'll be looking back and realising that she did you favour.

The bad thing was the bitterness wasn't from my side, it was from her in a typically female way. No direct confrontation, but after a few weeks ALLOT of people would not talk to me anymore, instantly hating me for no reason. After a bit of asking around with better friends and people who were more likely to shift their trust from one person to another, I came to know it was because of her and her friends badmouthing me behind my back. I already was bitter and blaming her for everything crap that happened, I'm only human indeed. I didn't really blame the MUD altogether for what happened anyways, more like the few people who sucked up to get me banned and Kali and Moonbeam, we simply abused their power to grant their "friends" a favor. And it's not my ex who is the issue, it's the fact I was banned for no reason at all. Heck, you're right. I now know a LOVELY australian girl who is far more lovely then that silly bint I refer to as my ex.

And I guess we are only "mortal" indeed...

And SL, regarding id I'd want to return to RoD, that would depend. If some people would apologize to me for the siteban and vow to leave me the hell alone on RoD, then sure.

Othwerwise, I'd rather eat my own feces and die a slow horrible death because of an ebola infection.

[Shao_Long]

well Seth..I see your point..Im tend to say that
1. That your ex-girlfriend isnt worth anything at all,if she acted as you're saying
2. I understand you well,cuz I myself had such stuff happening to me too.
3. I'd be really happy to help ya,though I think it would be much easier to first get you to mud,cuz im not even av myself.
4. And,does apologies from such ba$ta^ds mean a lot for you ?
5. Btw : If your aussie is as good as mine is,gratziallazz australians are cute
6. so,what about we get you on RoD , and then figure out what to do ? *evil grin*

[Seth]

Originally Posted by (Shao_Long @ May 03 2002,8:31 pm) well Seth..I see your point..Im tend to say that 1. That your ex-girlfriend isnt worth anything at all,if she acted as you're saying 2. I understand you well,cuz I myself had such stuff happening to me too. 3. I'd be really happy to help ya,though I think it would be much easier to first get you to mud,cuz im not even av myself. 4. And,does apologies from such ba$ta^ds mean a lot for you ? 5. Btw : If your aussie is as good as mine is,gratziallazz australians are cute 6. so,what about we get you on RoD , and then figure out what to do ? *evil grin*

1. Too true...
2. Trust me, that is only the beginning.
3. My name is an anethema on RoD these days... I don't that it would be a good idea.
4. Hell yeah! With them apologizing, this will be a grand victory!
5. Indeed they are Now I gotta get this weird accent out of her, hrm...
6. Apologies first. See 3 & 4.

[Shao_Long]

hm..well,wouldnt it be much more pleasant for you to rain down rightful vengeance upon their heads ?

And hey..I dont think such losers could mean anything for you..Nor any of their words..