Tavern of the Blue Hand

nass · 05-13-2002, 04:26 AM

I'm bound to have left some off. But the point is really to see what single factor annoys mudders more than anything alse, and makes you say "**** this place" =).

AnnOnimous · 05-13-2002, 11:54 AM

First I'm gonna say, yeah, there's some stuff that wasn't hit upon, but my main problem with this being a poll is that I have to choose just one. I'm a patient person for the most part and if a mud's got enough good features I can overlook some of my worst pet peeves. So rather than voting I'm going to list the ones that are listed and add to them.

Unreliable uptime (lag, feezes, downtime) {and if it stays down too long}
Confusing and unclear introduction screens and chargen
Existing player attitudes (ie unfriendly, cliques) {or even too friendly, I play muds for a bit of a challenge, if I want help with something I'll ask, I don't need to be powerlevelled from the minute I log on.}
Too hard (you get PKd as soon as you log on)
MUD philosophy/thrust doesn't conform to what you like
Too few players when you type "who", mud seems 'dead' {Or, for me, too MANY players, I come from a cozy mud where you don't have to turn off channels to see what you're doing most of the time, and a lot of players causes a lot of spam}
Bugs -obvious from when you log on the first time {This depends solely on the bugs, if they're minor I can overlook them, but if they interfere too much with the gameplay...}

Now for my own list of personal peeves that will cause me to leave a mud.

Too much color, yes it's petty, and yes, I can do away with color, but I like a bit of contrast for global channels and tells and stuff. But when the entire mud is completely colored.... *shudder*

Stock areas or generally blah room descriptions. If I watch a movie is has to be worth watching and not based on a sorely overused storyline. If I play a mud, it has to be worth reading, and something different than any of the others I've seen, and really, the only way to make a mud different for someone who has just logged in is to make the rooms and areas different.

Newbie Areas! Informative and entertaining, all I've got to say is the mud I'm on has the best one I've seen so far and I make alts at times just so I can go through it again. I'm not sure exactly what it is about newbie areas, but I have left some muds solely on the basis of not liking their newbie area.

Continuity - If your mud is based on a book or a movie it should (in my opinion) stay true to it's basis, no elves in Wheel of Time, no Trollocs in Middle Earth, get my drift?

Anyway, this post is getting longer than I like, and I think I've touched on the major bothering points for me, so I'll let it rest for now.

Koryon · 05-13-2002, 12:14 PM

Nothing new there -> Expanded a bit.

After playing KaVir's Last City for awhile, well, I found it's sorta like to a mud what Grand Theft Auto 3 is to a console game. You can build your own house/smithy/other buildings, make roads, dig tunnels, mine, smith, chop down trees, make your own equipment from ores, skins or wood, etc.

And THEN there's the World Of Darkness vampires, and most disciplines and abilities functional.

I liken it to an immersiveness deal, If the game is so immersive that you don't *WANT* to spend time chatting on the global channels, you'd rather show off what you can do (be it a fighting skill or otherwise), then it's good.

Soki · 05-13-2002, 01:22 PM

My two biggest peeves would have to be too much color and the inability to get rid of the prompt.

I can deal with almost everything else unless a mud has a poor helpfile system AND poor newbie help.

Dulan · 05-13-2002, 01:30 PM

People like Shao_Long.

Enough said.

-D

Rytorth · 05-13-2002, 02:13 PM

There's a lot of things I can take. The MU* not helping out when I'm going through chargen or trying to make me blind with too-bright colours are not things I can take. These are things that make me leave in disgust. There's also things that, instead of leaving me in disgust, make me flee for the hills. One of these is too-friendly players. If I want help, I'll ask for it. Having it offered to me when I don't need it is like being stuffed with food you have no need of and don't like anyways.

Kyandra · 05-13-2002, 08:24 PM

How about an all the above? They all factor into why you like or do not like something.

nass · 05-14-2002, 03:34 AM

Wow, interesting, I wouldn't have expected "Existing player attitudes (ie unfriendly, cliques)" to be ahead of everything else. Appreciate you all taking the time to fill it out.

Mnemosyne · 05-30-2002, 03:06 AM

A huge conglomoration of it all, actually.

Color dosen't bug me too much. if it's EYE KILLINGLY BAD, then I dislike it, but excessive color isn't TOO evil...

Lack of atmosphere really does it for me. If I dont' feel like I'm.. well, there, I get distracted, my attention wanders, and I eventually don't bother coming back. I've known some great muds with little to no atmosphere. S'a shame.

For god's sake, CRAP WRITING. If you can barely spell, DON'T DO THIS. If your room descriptions are a line and a half, if all the backstory is contrived and stupid, if every single storyline is predictable and dull, KILL IT. I'm a writer. I'm an avid reader. I can NOT stay on a mud with crap writing. I can't even stand it for five minutes. It just ****es me off.

Too easy is another one. If you log on and your newbie equipment makes you into something akin to God, no. Bad. Wrong. Hell, if the stuff you find during your travels is worse than the stuff you were born with, that's bad. Unlike some players, I DON'T want level 50 as soon as I'm there (I'm a certified slow leveler, heh

), I DON'T want spellups at level 1, I DON'T want free great equipment or godlike abilities. I want to work for it.

Insane imms is another one. I've seen one too many cliquey, power-mad immortal. Most are fun. Most are just normal people (another pet peeve: no, treating an imm like a normal person is not brown-nosing). Some are complete arses. These make me FLEE LIKE HELL. A mud could be absolutely great, but if I'm going to be constantly assaulted by the "gods", it's not worth my time.

So, basically:
If it dosen't look like it was written by a sixth grader,
If it FEELS like I'm there,
If it dosen't make me godlike at level 1,
If the imms aren't escaped mental patients

it has potential.

That is all.

-Mnem, dead tired at 3 am.

Molly · 06-01-2002, 04:15 AM

My own main pet peeve is control freak imms.

If there are tons of unnecessary rules about every conceivable situation that you are supposed to read before you log in, it gives you a hint about what to expect.

I might give it a chance anyway, but if it turns out to be the kind where the imms interfere with the gameplay constantly, force you to behave in certain ways, or - worst of all - snoop and spy on private conversation... *shudder*

That's just not MY idea of fun.

Dre · 06-19-2002, 03:17 AM

Heya all,

Personally I think it's the first view that I get. If I login and I see no players I think the mud is bad or something (or doesn't have other dutch players

If someone immediately asks if you need help I think let's stick around for a while and ask what the mud has to offer to me. I also try to check the map or whatever world view they have, to see if it's all stock or alot of own made areas too. Oh and the character creation is important too, if I see a thousand races I don't believe that they add anything to the gameplay, or that I have to make too many choices before I can play how I want to.

Greetings Dre

08-28-2002, 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by (Dre @ June 19 2002,03:17 am)

Heya all,

Personally I think it's the first view that I get. If I login and I see no players I think the mud is bad or something (or doesn't have other dutch players

If someone immediately asks if you need help I think let's stick around for a while and ask what the mud has to offer to me. I also try to check the map or whatever world view they have, to see if it's all stock or alot of own made areas too. Oh and the character creation is important too, if I see a thousand races I don't believe that they add anything to the gameplay, or that I have to make too many choices before I can play how I want to.

Greetings Dre

Medelander!!!

*hangt de vlag uit*

If it aint dutch it aint much!

Wooo!

Enzo · 08-29-2002, 02:10 AM

I have this problem with the MUDs I continously play. THere's this character that stormed off right before a Player Wipe because "I'm getting PK'ed too much and nobody respects that I don't want it..." and some bs like that (I won't go into the circumstances really, but everybody was in his position except like 2 people). Then he came back after the player wipe and he's a total jerk. Ruins RP, bad OOC attitude, etc. I hate attitudes from Players. ARGH!

thelenian · 08-29-2002, 03:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by

I hate attitudes from Players. ARGH!

So you'd rather have attitude from.... the admin?

(sorry, couldn't resist

).

Zane · 08-29-2002, 03:37 AM

What can turn me away from a MUD is it's layout. Yeah, it's text but if it's neat and easy to follow I'll at least give the mud a chance. Color plays into it a bit but it can be tons of color as long as it's used properly, not thrown in just for the fun of it.

After the layout it comes to features, the autolist is one of the first things I check out, I've only found one mud that has autoopen and I loved that feature!

Illiandra · 08-29-2002, 02:54 PM

Something unexpected. In chargen. In the first time I try to fight a mob. In my first rp interaction. In the equipment I have on. Something unexpected, but interesting, well done, and intriguing.

That is what will make me try a game out. And continuing to have such experiences, be they code based, character based or immortal/GM/wizard based, until I have reached that happily addicted state, is what keeps me on a MU**.

(Edited to comment: Yeah yeah, I know, I am supposed to put what I do not like in a MU**. But I was feeling positive today, so deal ::wink:

Yuki · 08-29-2002, 03:42 PM

What has made me not play a mud:

If it's mostly stock.

If it's mostly stock but the players still think it's the best thing since sliced bread.

If it's mostly stock and snippets, that the players thing are the best things ever.

The players are stuck up assholes (generally due to lower pbase, where players then think they are precious stocks and can act like asses)

It has a stock smaug color scheme, or any color scheme that makes me blind.

Immortals are power tripping assholes.

They don't like orange chicken.

The owner sells porn for a living.

I guess a number of things, I guess those are the instant turn offs though.

Artovil · 08-29-2002, 05:40 PM

The first thing that generally makes me slam the disconnect button would probably be general attitude and policies. If the mud in question have rules that somehow take for granted that all players are either morons, cheaters, or hackers, then I just move on, right quick. I am neither, and I live by the simple rule that assumption is the mother of all screw-ups, which in this case would place these mud admins somewhere along the evolutionary scale between amoebas and troglodytes. Id est, not my kind of mud.

Although, I generally tend to try to see the better in the mud before I leave, but if I log in and have to scroll through a long list of "policy" threats and then face a mud filled with PKers and mob bashers, I usually do not stick around for long.

On the other hand, if I am greeted by a nice screen with comfortable help and a somewhat intuitive character creation system, and then log in and somebody at least greet me and acknowledge my existance, then I am usually positive towards the mud until I feel I know more about the setting.

I like crafting and player economies to a point, and I can make do in a guild, but what I really like is the free role play, where you can just sit down and have fun for a while with people that are relatively intelligent. I really can't stand these people that have to prove themselves better in everything, they kind of take the fun out of it for me. Emote combat would serve as an excellent example here. These people that sit there and block every blow you throw at them, wouldn't last a second in real heavy combat. They nimbly dance to the side in their full plate armor and swing their hand-and-a-half sword down in a graceful arc aimed at your skull, while in real life you could have walked up beside them and toppled them over like a cow. Sheesh.

smadronia · 08-29-2002, 11:31 PM

I voted with Exiwsting player attitudes, but it's more general than that: Bad attitudes. Doesn't matter if it's the imms or the mortals, if I get the feeling that I'm not wanted, forget it. I hate logging into muds and hearing "Great, ANOTHER newbie." At that point I'm ready to say "I guess you must have sprung from the mud at the top level then," but knowing my luck, they did.

Attitudes bug me the most, second is pk. If I'm checking out a mud that claims to be restricted pk, and I find out they define "restricted" as "You're safe until level 10" forget it. I'm there to explore the mud, not get my ass handed to me after 2 levels. That's why I avoid open pk muds.

05-13-2002, 04:26 AM	#1
nass Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 123	I'm bound to have left some off. But the point is really to see what single factor annoys mudders more than anything alse, and makes you say "**** this place" =).

05-13-2002, 11:54 AM	#2
AnnOnimous New Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 14	First I'm gonna say, yeah, there's some stuff that wasn't hit upon, but my main problem with this being a poll is that I have to choose just one. I'm a patient person for the most part and if a mud's got enough good features I can overlook some of my worst pet peeves. So rather than voting I'm going to list the ones that are listed and add to them. Unreliable uptime (lag, feezes, downtime) {and if it stays down too long} Confusing and unclear introduction screens and chargen Existing player attitudes (ie unfriendly, cliques) {or even too friendly, I play muds for a bit of a challenge, if I want help with something I'll ask, I don't need to be powerlevelled from the minute I log on.} Too hard (you get PKd as soon as you log on) MUD philosophy/thrust doesn't conform to what you like Too few players when you type "who", mud seems 'dead' {Or, for me, too MANY players, I come from a cozy mud where you don't have to turn off channels to see what you're doing most of the time, and a lot of players causes a lot of spam} Bugs -obvious from when you log on the first time {This depends solely on the bugs, if they're minor I can overlook them, but if they interfere too much with the gameplay...} Now for my own list of personal peeves that will cause me to leave a mud. Too much color, yes it's petty, and yes, I can do away with color, but I like a bit of contrast for global channels and tells and stuff. But when the entire mud is completely colored.... shudder Stock areas or generally blah room descriptions. If I watch a movie is has to be worth watching and not based on a sorely overused storyline. If I play a mud, it has to be worth reading, and something different than any of the others I've seen, and really, the only way to make a mud different for someone who has just logged in is to make the rooms and areas different. Newbie Areas! Informative and entertaining, all I've got to say is the mud I'm on has the best one I've seen so far and I make alts at times just so I can go through it again. I'm not sure exactly what it is about newbie areas, but I have left some muds solely on the basis of not liking their newbie area. Continuity - If your mud is based on a book or a movie it should (in my opinion) stay true to it's basis, no elves in Wheel of Time, no Trollocs in Middle Earth, get my drift? Anyway, this post is getting longer than I like, and I think I've touched on the major bothering points for me, so I'll let it rest for now.

05-13-2002, 12:14 PM	#3
Koryon Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 50	Nothing new there -> Expanded a bit. After playing KaVir's Last City for awhile, well, I found it's sorta like to a mud what Grand Theft Auto 3 is to a console game. You can build your own house/smithy/other buildings, make roads, dig tunnels, mine, smith, chop down trees, make your own equipment from ores, skins or wood, etc. And THEN there's the World Of Darkness vampires, and most disciplines and abilities functional. I liken it to an immersiveness deal, If the game is so immersive that you don't WANT to spend time chatting on the global channels, you'd rather show off what you can do (be it a fighting skill or otherwise), then it's good.

05-13-2002, 01:22 PM	#4
Soki Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 37	My two biggest peeves would have to be too much color and the inability to get rid of the prompt. I can deal with almost everything else unless a mud has a poor helpfile system AND poor newbie help.

05-13-2002, 01:30 PM	#5
Dulan Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 354	People like Shao_Long. Enough said. -D

05-13-2002, 02:13 PM	#6
Rytorth Senior Member Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 364	There's a lot of things I can take. The MU* not helping out when I'm going through chargen or trying to make me blind with too-bright colours are not things I can take. These are things that make me leave in disgust. There's also things that, instead of leaving me in disgust, make me flee for the hills. One of these is too-friendly players. If I want help, I'll ask for it. Having it offered to me when I don't need it is like being stuffed with food you have no need of and don't like anyways.

05-13-2002, 08:24 PM	#7
Kyandra Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: California, USA Posts: 67	How about an all the above? They all factor into why you like or do not like something.

05-14-2002, 03:34 AM	#8
nass Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 123	Wow, interesting, I wouldn't have expected "Existing player attitudes (ie unfriendly, cliques)" to be ahead of everything else. Appreciate you all taking the time to fill it out.

05-30-2002, 03:06 AM	#9
Mnemosyne New Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 16	A huge conglomoration of it all, actually. Color dosen't bug me too much. if it's EYE KILLINGLY BAD, then I dislike it, but excessive color isn't TOO evil... Lack of atmosphere really does it for me. If I dont' feel like I'm.. well, there, I get distracted, my attention wanders, and I eventually don't bother coming back. I've known some great muds with little to no atmosphere. S'a shame. For god's sake, CRAP WRITING. If you can barely spell, DON'T DO THIS. If your room descriptions are a line and a half, if all the backstory is contrived and stupid, if every single storyline is predictable and dull, KILL IT. I'm a writer. I'm an avid reader. I can NOT stay on a mud with crap writing. I can't even stand it for five minutes. It just ****es me off. Too easy is another one. If you log on and your newbie equipment makes you into something akin to God, no. Bad. Wrong. Hell, if the stuff you find during your travels is worse than the stuff you were born with, that's bad. Unlike some players, I DON'T want level 50 as soon as I'm there (I'm a certified slow leveler, heh ), I DON'T want spellups at level 1, I DON'T want free great equipment or godlike abilities. I want to work for it. Insane imms is another one. I've seen one too many cliquey, power-mad immortal. Most are fun. Most are just normal people (another pet peeve: no, treating an imm like a normal person is not brown-nosing). Some are complete arses. These make me FLEE LIKE HELL. A mud could be absolutely great, but if I'm going to be constantly assaulted by the "gods", it's not worth my time. So, basically: If it dosen't look like it was written by a sixth grader, If it FEELS like I'm there, If it dosen't make me godlike at level 1, If the imms aren't escaped mental patients it has potential. That is all. -Mnem, dead tired at 3 am.

06-01-2002, 04:15 AM	#10
Molly Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Sweden Home MUD: 4 Dimensions Posts: 476	My own main pet peeve is control freak imms. If there are tons of unnecessary rules about every conceivable situation that you are supposed to read before you log in, it gives you a hint about what to expect. I might give it a chance anyway, but if it turns out to be the kind where the imms interfere with the gameplay constantly, force you to behave in certain ways, or - worst of all - snoop and spy on private conversation... shudder That's just not MY idea of fun.

06-19-2002, 03:17 AM	#11
Dre Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: the Netherlands Posts: 65	Heya all, Personally I think it's the first view that I get. If I login and I see no players I think the mud is bad or something (or doesn't have other dutch players If someone immediately asks if you need help I think let's stick around for a while and ask what the mud has to offer to me. I also try to check the map or whatever world view they have, to see if it's all stock or alot of own made areas too. Oh and the character creation is important too, if I see a thousand races I don't believe that they add anything to the gameplay, or that I have to make too many choices before I can play how I want to. Greetings Dre

08-29-2002, 02:10 AM	#13
Enzo Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Seattle, Washington Posts: 342	I have this problem with the MUDs I continously play. THere's this character that stormed off right before a Player Wipe because "I'm getting PK'ed too much and nobody respects that I don't want it..." and some bs like that (I won't go into the circumstances really, but everybody was in his position except like 2 people). Then he came back after the player wipe and he's a total jerk. Ruins RP, bad OOC attitude, etc. I hate attitudes from Players. ARGH!

08-29-2002, 03:37 AM	#15
Zane New Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 8	What can turn me away from a MUD is it's layout. Yeah, it's text but if it's neat and easy to follow I'll at least give the mud a chance. Color plays into it a bit but it can be tons of color as long as it's used properly, not thrown in just for the fun of it. After the layout it comes to features, the autolist is one of the first things I check out, I've only found one mud that has autoopen and I loved that feature!

08-29-2002, 02:54 PM	#16
Illiandra New Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 3	Something unexpected. In chargen. In the first time I try to fight a mob. In my first rp interaction. In the equipment I have on. Something unexpected, but interesting, well done, and intriguing. That is what will make me try a game out. And continuing to have such experiences, be they code based, character based or immortal/GM/wizard based, until I have reached that happily addicted state, is what keeps me on a MU. (Edited to comment: Yeah yeah, I know, I am supposed to put what I do not like in a MU. But I was feeling positive today, so deal ::wink:

08-29-2002, 03:42 PM	#17
Yuki Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: My laptop, my apt, Columbus, Ohio, USA Posts: 42	What has made me not play a mud: If it's mostly stock. If it's mostly stock but the players still think it's the best thing since sliced bread. If it's mostly stock and snippets, that the players thing are the best things ever. The players are stuck up assholes (generally due to lower pbase, where players then think they are precious stocks and can act like asses) It has a stock smaug color scheme, or any color scheme that makes me blind. Immortals are power tripping assholes. They don't like orange chicken. The owner sells porn for a living. I guess a number of things, I guess those are the instant turn offs though.

08-29-2002, 05:40 PM	#18
Artovil Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Sweden Posts: 32	The first thing that generally makes me slam the disconnect button would probably be general attitude and policies. If the mud in question have rules that somehow take for granted that all players are either morons, cheaters, or hackers, then I just move on, right quick. I am neither, and I live by the simple rule that assumption is the mother of all screw-ups, which in this case would place these mud admins somewhere along the evolutionary scale between amoebas and troglodytes. Id est, not my kind of mud. Although, I generally tend to try to see the better in the mud before I leave, but if I log in and have to scroll through a long list of "policy" threats and then face a mud filled with PKers and mob bashers, I usually do not stick around for long. On the other hand, if I am greeted by a nice screen with comfortable help and a somewhat intuitive character creation system, and then log in and somebody at least greet me and acknowledge my existance, then I am usually positive towards the mud until I feel I know more about the setting. I like crafting and player economies to a point, and I can make do in a guild, but what I really like is the free role play, where you can just sit down and have fun for a while with people that are relatively intelligent. I really can't stand these people that have to prove themselves better in everything, they kind of take the fun out of it for me. Emote combat would serve as an excellent example here. These people that sit there and block every blow you throw at them, wouldn't last a second in real heavy combat. They nimbly dance to the side in their full plate armor and swing their hand-and-a-half sword down in a graceful arc aimed at your skull, while in real life you could have walked up beside them and toppled them over like a cow. Sheesh.

08-29-2002, 11:31 PM	#19
smadronia Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Coeur d'Alene, ID Posts: 65	I voted with Exiwsting player attitudes, but it's more general than that: Bad attitudes. Doesn't matter if it's the imms or the mortals, if I get the feeling that I'm not wanted, forget it. I hate logging into muds and hearing "Great, ANOTHER newbie." At that point I'm ready to say "I guess you must have sprung from the mud at the top level then," but knowing my luck, they did. Attitudes bug me the most, second is pk. If I'm checking out a mud that claims to be restricted pk, and I find out they define "restricted" as "You're safe until level 10" forget it. I'm there to explore the mud, not get my ass handed to me after 2 levels. That's why I avoid open pk muds.

Tavern of the Blue Hand

Things that make you NOT play a MUD