[Angie]

I can understand why Medievia was readmitted on the list - I'm not happy that it was, but we don't live in a perfect world. So I just sighed, didn't comment on it, and thought to myself that they could at least keep a lower profile.

The attitude you show in this thread really makes me cringe though, Soleil. Cut down the smileys, you have nothing to feel smug about.

[Soleil]

Sure I do, I have a wonderful life, a wonderful family and a very successful business.  I have a lot to be happy about.  Just because there are some of you who hate my business and scorn everything we do doesn't really bother me at all.  As I said in my last post, if you chose to live in the past, so be it.  Please don't expect me or Medievia to though.  There is no reason why we should have to keep a low profile, we have one of the most successful games in the MUD world.  I'm proud of it despite the things you people believe and say.

[Samson]

Originally Posted by I do want to say this though... Medievia did not STEAL anything - Geez. Choosing not to follow a ridiculous, irrelevant and ancient license does not equate stealing.

Originally Posted by Ahh look at all the animosity! Such a shame really.

Wow. I don't normally get myself involved in this issue, and I hadn't planned on even commenting about this, but ####. Do you not even see the forest for the trees here? Do you not realize why it is people hold the animosity toward you, Mike, and your game when you make such statements? Would you not be upset if I came along, stole your code, removed the credits, and then put it up on the net and claimed it was my own work and started charging people money to play?

Going on to state that your PROUD of being a criminal is the realy disturbing part though. I've never seen you or Mike make such a blatent display of your disregard for yourselves, the community, and the Diku/Merc authors.

It's also equally amazing to me that any site operator would willingly accept money from these people when they display such an open contempt for everything the site is about.

[Wik]

Originally Posted by Also- not a question but a comment- we do not consider ourselves a DIKU derivative.

I wonder if Michael Jackson still considers himself African-American.

On a more serious note, though. Does saying that you've brutally conquered your enemies (the fact that you've out-bullied and out-lasted the DIKU developers) mean you're okay people, or that what you did isn't very, very wrong, and worthy of censure and scorn?

I think this is simply a case of the winners attempting to re-write the history books. Personally, I tell the players of my game the story of Medievia every few years, just so it's never forgotten.

[Soleil]

Laugh, proud to be a criminal?  Where did I say that?  I love how you people twist everything to suit your needs.  YOU (that can be directed toward anyone who keep these "methievia" claims alive) believe us to be criminals.  

I am proud of the business that Mike and I work hard to maintain.  I am proud of the progress that Medievia has made throughout the years despite all this mess. I am proud of the gods who volunteer countless hours of their lives towards the future of Medievia.  I am proud of the players who log in everyday and help move Medievia forward.  I am proud of the Mud site owners who realize that your claims are a part of the past and see that it is time to move forward.  

Ok, I really am done for the day.  It's time for me to spend some time with my family who is proud of me for being the person I am, not the criminal some of you believe me to be.

[KaVir]

Originally Posted by (Soleil @ May 08 2005,20:47) It's time for me to spend some time with my family who is proud of me for being the person I am, not the criminal some of you believe me to be.

And do you think your children will be proud when they grow up, surf the net, and discover that mummy and daddy have made a living off something they stole from someone else?

[Traithe]

Originally Posted by (Soleil @ May 08 2005,07:07) The DIKU license could not hold up in a court of law even if they wanted to do anything, which they don't.

Wow, I didn't realize you were a lawyer.

It's a shame the DIKU guys are so uninterested in enforcing their copyright. I'd bet they could even find a pretty decent pro bono attorney for a case like this; even if they couldn't, they wouldn't have a whole lot to lose if they didn't prevail with the suit. You, on the other hand, would stand to lose your livelihood and a significant chunk of your life for over the past 10 years or so. Plus, with all the insane criminalizing-of-copyright-violation statutes flying around lately, maybe more, who knows.

So, yeah. Be as smug and shameless as you like about it; just hope, for your sake, that they don't change their mind.

[Soleil]

Ok, really last post...

Our lawyers HAVE looked at the license and have assured Mike that it is poorly written, full of holes, and could not stand up in court. So, I really don't think there's anything to worry about there.

Happy Mother's Day!

[Traithe]

2-->

Originally Posted by (Soleil @ May 08 2005,15[img http://www.topmudsites.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif[/img]2)]Our lawyers HAVE looked at the license and have assured Mike that it is poorly written, full of holes, and could not stand up in court.

Yeah - it isn't like you're PAYING them or anything, right?

And besides; I find the ridiculously voluminous number of court cases and appeals rather amusing, given most lawyers' tendency to be ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN that they're right when asked a legal question.

Judges are lawyers, too. Lawyers disagree. Ergo, your lawyers might be right - or they might be wrong.

But, hey - if it helps you sleep at night, I guess they're doing their job!

[KaVir]

Teacher to Kid: And what do your parents do for a living?

Kid: Well, they stole the university project of some students, ripped out the credits, and passed it off as their own. Then they tell people its free, but once the people have played for a while, they discover they have to give lots of money in order to compete!

Teacher to Kid: You must be so proud!

[dragon master]

Originally Posted by (Soleil @ May 08 2005,15:02) Ok, really last post... Our lawyers HAVE looked at the license and have assured Mike that it is poorly written, full of holes, and could not stand up in court.  So, I really don't think there's anything to worry about there. Happy Mother's Day!

So, if you can steal something without getting in legal trouble for it, you think there is nothing morally wrong with stealing it?

Maybe it's true that you have nothing to worry about legally, but morally it's another matter. It's great to see though, that all you worry about is covering your *** from the law and cashing in from other people's stolen property.

If the law can't do anything about it, then this is an example of a weakness of the law, not a strength of Medievia.

[Samson]

Originally Posted by Our lawyers HAVE looked at the license and have assured Mike that it is poorly written, full of holes, and could not stand up in court. So, I really don't think there's anything to worry about there.

Actually, there is something to worry about. That license was the only thing granting you any rights to use the work at all, and your decision to disregard it means you've rejected the terms, which means you have no rights under copyright law to use the code. Your lawyer should have told you this if he's worth one nickel of what you guys paid him for that oh so brilliant opinion.

[gth]

Just thought I'd add my voice to the list of people that would prefer TMS didn't accept money from lying thieves.

Personally, if I lived near you, Mike, I'd key your car and smack your kids on their way to school daily. You're in need of some serious karma and I hope you get everything that's coming to you. Here, have a smug smiley...

[the_logos]

Originally Posted by (Qud @ May 08 2005,11:39) Seeing Medthievia here, however, made me quite upset.   I don't think they should be featured here, shameless bastard corrupt lying thieves that they are.  "So what if we stole the codebase, it was X years ago and we added Y lines of code since"?  Go to ####.

Do you know how many games there are listed here that have stolen IP? Every Star Wars text MUD in existence, or any MUD that uses Star Wars IP is breaking the Lucas license, for instance. They're stealing the IP. Nobody makes a big deal about them, even though that IP is actually worth billions of dollars.

Some of you are on an incredibly closed-minded and juvenile crusade.

--matt

[Angie]

Originally Posted by (the_logos @ May 09 2005,02:23) Some of you are on an incredibly closed-minded and juvenile crusade.

As the maxim goes: I like an open mind, but not so open that your brains fall out.

Edit: In case my point wasn't clear, I find your notion of open- and close-mindedness mighty strange.

[the_logos]

Originally Posted by (Angie @ May 08 2005,19:29) Originally Posted by (the_logos @ May 09 2005,02:23) Some of you are on an incredibly closed-minded and juvenile crusade. As the maxim goes: I like an open mind, but not so open that your brains fall out.

Again, I ask why all the vitriol towards some license breakers but not others? The inability or unwillingness to apply consistent standards to all muds on this issue just screams "Witch hunt." If you're against IP violations, why is there no outcry about the legions of them? Or is it just that you don't like Medievia specifically and this is a reason to hate on them? (Yes, I realize you're not one of the more vitriolic attackers.)

--matt

[KaVir]

This tired old argument again, the_logos?

To equate deliberately overlooked works of fan fiction with a mud that has taken someone else's work, ripped out the credits, and made a living from running it against their specific and repeated wishes, is laughable.

I'm not sure which is the saddest - that Medthievia claims to be so proud about a mud they now admit to having ripped off, or that a so-called "professional" would then jump to their defence.

[the_logos]

Originally Posted by (KaVir @ May 08 2005,19:43) This tired old argument again, the_logos? To equate deliberately overlooked works of fan fiction with a mud that has taken someone else's work, ripped out the credits, and made a living from running it against their specific and repeated wishes, is laughable. I'm not sure which is the saddest - that Medthievia claims to be so proud about a mud they now admit to having ripped off, or that a so-called "professional" would then jump to their defence.

You're accusing ME of pulling up a tired old argument? How long have you been flogging this dead horse? A decade? I mean, I can see why you keep it up, given how fabulously effective your crusade has been in shutting them down and keeping them off mud portals.

The Lucas license is clear in its prohibition of using the Star Wars IP. People have chosen to ignore that license, just as Medievia says they've chosen to ignore the DIKU license. The major difference, of course, is that the Lucas IP is worth billions of dollars whereas the DIKU license is worth practically nothing.

And "Medthievia." How 5th grade. Are you going to start making plays on Mike's last name now or something?

--matt