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Old 05-19-2002, 05:33 PM   #1
Robbert
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Having been a fan of Episodes IV thru VI when they came out, and waited breathlessly for I when it was released, I was disappointed to say the least. After much thinking, (the initial concept came from elsewhere, the majority of these points are my own), I've a theory to share with you. Note that I've had this in circulation since shortly after Episode I was released:

I'll not include anything from Episode II in this dissertation, to avoid spoilers for those who have not yet seen it. It is sufficient to know that nothing adequately disproves this theory in that episode.

In short, I propose that George Lucas is using Star Wars Episodes I thru III to bring us the mind screw of the millenium. If I am correct, this will be spoken of for years to come, and quite possibly never surpassed. What is it, you ask?

My proposal is this: Rather than the common belief, as suggested by Mr Lucas in Episodes IV thru VI, and reinforced by assumptions in I and II, Anakin does not grow up to become Darth Vader. Rather, Obi Wan Kenobi becomes Vader, and Anakin takes the name Obi Wan.

Follow my twisted logic for a moment, if you will.... To avoid confusion, I will refer to Obi Wan-Vader link as VADER, and Anakin-Obi Wan as BEN..

In Episode I, we see Qui Gonn, one of the greatest bladesmen in the Jedi Order (as shown in the book by Terry Brooks', although not clearly expounded in the movie), defeated by Darth Maul. Minutes later, Obi Wan Kenobi, student of Qui Gonn and not even a full Jedi, manages to do that which his master could not. How? By submission to the Dark Side. His master has just been killed, and he is about to die. Fear, and rage, fuel the energy necessary to allow Obi Wan to kill Darth Maul.

Throughout Episode I, from their very first appearance as Ambassador's, Obi Wan Kenobi's actions suggest that he feels they should be accorded respect greater than they are receiving. On Tatooine, he suggests just announcing who they are and demanding help. On the Trade Federation ship, he questions that they would be treated as they are were it known they were Jedi.

Note also, dear reader, the disdain Obi Wan has for droids.

Now shoot to Episode IV. In it, we first encounter Obi Wan on Tatooine (which he refers to as a 'desert rock on the outer rim' in Episode I....!, saving Luke from the Tusken Raiders. Luke says the droid, R2D2, is looking for a man named Obi Wan Kenobi. BEN sits down and says, "That is a name I have not heard in a long, long time." Later he says, "That was my name, once". In his hut, he gives Luke a lightsaber, and says, "Your father wanted you to have this when you were old enough."

Whoa, stop. This should send up a red flag. Because in Episode VI, we hear the image of BEN tell Luke, "Your presence was kept hidden from the Empire lest they seek to subvert you to the dark side." So, why would VADER come to BEN and say, "Look, man, I know we're enemies and stuff, but if I ever have a son, I want you to give him this lightsaber of mine...?" On the other hand, if Luke is the son of BEN (remember, BEN is Anakin), then it makes perfect sense for the father to be on his homeplanet watching over his son, as a protector.

BEN tells Luke, "Your father was murdered by a man named Darth Vader." This could be true, in a sense - Anakin Skywalker ceased to exist when Obi Wan Kenobi became Darth Vader, and Anakin took the name Obi Wan Kenobi. Confused? It makes sense, if you think about it - the republic would not follow a padowan apprentice, even if the other Jedi are all destroyed (which we know to be an upcoming event). However, they -would- follow a known Jedi Knight. Anakin could easily take the name Obi Wan Kenobi and lead them during the clone wars.

Also in Episode IV: BEN tells VADER, on the Death Star, "You can't win, Darth. If you destroy me now, I shall become more powerful than you ever could imagine." Now, if we follow the common mentality of VADER being Anakin, this is an impossible statement, since Anakin has the highest midchlorian count ever registered - nothing can be more powerful than he. On the other hand, if we follow my twisted logic, it makes sense: BEN is telling VADER, "You thought I was the sh--- before, but if you try to kill me I'll become even MORE powerful." During that same battle, VADER says, "When last we met, I was the student. Now I am the master." We are led to believe that this implies the relationship between VADER and BEN. I disagree. Rather, I believe it is referencing the time when Anakin and Obi Wan fight, when Obi Wan is student to the Dark Side.

Not convinced yet? I'll reiterate my point: Obi Wan Kenobi becomes VADER, and Anakin Skywalker becomes BEN Kenobi.

In Episode V, on the planet of Hoth, we see the image of BEN talking to Luke. It says, "You will go to the Dagobah system. There you will learn from Yoda, the Jedi Master who taught me."

Who taught Obi Wan Kenobi, folks? It sure wasn't the little green man. However, it's quite possible that, after VADER declares himself a lord of the Sith, that Anakin's training is finished by Yoda.

Yet more in Episode V: VADER wants to make Luke join the Dark Side. The heart of the Dark Side lies in imbalance. VADER unbalances Luke's mind, trying to confuse him, in telling him the LIE that he is Luke's father. Watch this scene carefully, with an open mind - there's guesswork involved. VADER first asks if BEN ever talked about him and his father (perhaps seeking whether BEN told the truth about BEN being Lukes father), and when he sees the mistake BEN made, he monopolizes on it. He tells Luke he is his father, to upset him mentally and prepare him for the Dark Side. Luke resists, and chooses to die rather than convert, but is saved in the end by his sister....

The Emperor, when he talks with VADER, says "The son of Skywalker must not become a Jedi," and not, "Your son must not...". This gives credence to my claim that VADER telling Luke he is his father is a lie, and one not known by the Emperor.

In Episode VI, Luke is returned as a full Jedi. He has completed his training with Yoda, and is prepared to face VADER once more. Before Yoda dies, Luke asks him, "Master Yoda, is Vader my father?" Yoda looks away, and LIES to him. His ears sag, and he says, "Your father he is." This is because Yoda, being wise in the ways of the force, knows that if he tells the truth, then Luke will not face VADER, and the Empire will win.

On the Death Star, Palpatine taps Luke's lightsaber and suggests it is much like his fathers. Note that the lightsaber in question looks nothing like any VADER has ever used, yet is similar to the one BEN used in Episode IV.

Also in VI, VADER learns of Luke's sister. This throws question back to the point I raised in IV, wherein VADER supposedly told BEN, "Give this to my son...." (the lightsaber). It reinforces the fact that that conversation never would have happened - had VADER truly been Luke's father, he'd have used all the resources of the Empire to find his son, and would have discovered the twin.

Other thoughts:

Obi Wan Kenobi, as seen in Episode I, would never have retired into anonymity after being a famous general during the Clone Wars. Doubly so not onto a 'desert rock on the outer rim'. On the other hand, Anakin would easily have been at home there, watching over his son.

In Episode I, we hear the name "Baal Antilles of Alderaan", yet in Episode IV thru VI, when he is referenced it is as "Baal Organa". Leia is "Leia Organa". Luke's friend, and later commander of Rogue Squadron, is "Wedge Antilles". It's reasonable to assume that Organa is an Honorific, and if this is the case then possibly Baal Antilles Organa's son was sent to grow up with Luke, while Luke's sister was raised with Baal.

In Episode VI, VADER tells Luke, right before he dies, that he wants to gaze upon his son with his own eyes. I say this is because he has come to believe the lie he began in episode V, which ultimately allowed him to save his 'son' from the evil emperor - but which is nevertheless still a lie.

Remember, this is just a theory. If it is proven right in Episode III, then people across the world in theaters will yell "Ryan was right!" at the climactic moment...

George Lucas is a brilliant director. I do not believe Episodes I and II live up to his abilities, and this is my reason justifying that.
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Old 05-19-2002, 10:21 PM   #2
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Pretty good. But answer me this. How does Anakin become Ben Kenobi with his new golden mechanical arm?

It pretty much foreshadows his transition to Darth Vader.
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Old 05-20-2002, 12:02 AM   #3
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I myself am a huge Star Wars fan, a fan of the all things cannon (though I must say that George's shot at Kevin J. Anderson's claim to the Death Star being built in a mysterious 'Maw' was truely satisfying), and have only a couple of points to make concerning this theory.

First, a rather minor note, Wedge Antilles was a Corellian, not an Alderanean. If he's related to ANYONE we see in the movies it would probably be Captian Antilles, of the Tantive IV (The guy Vader choke-slammed into the wall of Leia's ship in Ep IV).

Second, as Ike pointed out, the end of AOTC pretty much forshadows Obi-Wan's saying 'He's more machine now than man, twisted and evil'. The mechanical arm is just the first part of the process.

Now, I know of a couple of points you can make FOR this theory as well, the first being that according to the novelization of the movies, Obi-Wan supposedly threw Anakin Skywalker into a volcano, which is WHY Vader is now more machine than man, and when we apply your theory to this quote it becomes pretty apperant that Obi-Wan would have had an easy way to assume BEN's name, while Vader, during his recovery is forced to subdue himself to countless surgeries and other emergency operations, which cut away major portions of his living body, and replace them with mechanical parts.

My next point contains a few very minor spoilers, but nothing too ground breaking, and really only a bit of commedy for those Star Wars diehards. If you're a fervent NoSpoiler type like myself, you may wish to skip over my next paragraph, otherwise, read on.

One of the funniest things one will see while viewing Episode II is that C-3P0 doesn't seem to ever recognize who Obi-Wan is, though he most definatly met him in Episode I. My friend sitting next to me in the theater, upon seeing this scene, broke out laughing and said, "3P0 never knows who Obi-Wan is!" And it got me to thinking, why not? I mean he meets him in Episode I, sees him again in Episode II, and quite probably spends quite a bit of time with him in Episode III, yet doesn't even recognize the name of Obi-Wan, or BEN Kenobi in Episode IV. There are really only two reasons why 3P0 wouldn't recognize BEN, the first, and most obvious being somewhere between Episode III and Episode IV 3P0 has a memory wipe, but the other reason is BEN is actually Anakin Skywalker. Look at it. 3P0 barely recognizes Anakin after not seeing him for ten years, give him another thirty and suddenly BEN is no longer the youth that 3P0 has in his memory circuts, but an elderly looking eccentric. Bam, just like that 3P0 doesn't recognize him, and we really can't decipher what R2 is saying, so he may or may not, but we're never given any indication either way. And then of course there is BEN's knowledge of how Tuskan Raiders operate....

But anyways that's my two cents on the whole issue. I think its pretty far fetched myself, but this just goes to show you that a story can be seen through many many different lenses.
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Old 05-20-2002, 12:29 AM   #4
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This article makes for an interesting read:

http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content....zbt.asp

-Synozeer
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Old 05-20-2002, 09:36 AM   #5
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Ok I had to jump into this since I just saw attack of the clones. The memory wipe theory makes since. Ok 3p0 and R2 are seen with Leia in episode IV even though she doesn't own them as 3p0 states to Luke in episode IV when R2 goes on about being owner of BEN. Now when Padme becomes pregnate with the twins she runs and hides. Meets Baal at some time has the kids and decides to seperate them. Now she has 2 tag along droids. Well smartest thing to do is to wipe thier memoies and give 3po a nice gold suit. Kinda like the witness protection program for droids. and since most Astromechs look alike in the R2 model only a memory wipe would be sufficent for R2. Now lets say Padem give luke to Obi-wan and tells him that luke has uncle on Tatooine. Obi-wan goes their gives luke to Lars and then basicly spends the rest of his life paying penince for 1) Falling for the Emperors tick even when the truth was revealed to him. and 2) Letting Anikin fall into the darkside. Hey thats heavy burden your actions and inactions got the majority of the Jedi counsel killed and enslaved 99% of the know univerise. Not alot of people can sit back say hey I'll have a bud and forget about it.

Just my thoughts.
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Old 05-20-2002, 11:38 AM   #6
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Problem: The novelization and a few other sources have always claimed that Owen Lars is BEN's brother. Coincidence, or just cannonical error? Sure I can follow the memory wipe thing, but the revelation that Anakin has a half brother, on Tatooine, is huge if you look at the novels closely.

On the other hand, George seems to like to use mythic themes in Star Wars, and one of the most prevelant mythic themes in the original is Oedipal in nature (Luke wants to kill his father, sleep with his mother..though Leia will do just as well). For every point we can come up with we can create a counter point to argue against it really. I say this has a 50/50 chance of being true. If it is George is going to look awesome, if not I'm sure Episode III will STILL kick ass.
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Old 05-20-2002, 02:33 PM   #7
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Exclamation

Though your post was intruiging, and somewhat funny, and I hate to post against something so creative, I decided there were enough things I disagreed with to do so.

One, you take a few things too literally.  Just because Ben says 'Your father wanted you to have this' does not mean Vader said, 'Ben, when my son becomes a legal       and able to carry concealed weapons, would you give him this?'.  More likely, Ben keeps Vader's lightsaber (after the volcano fight, or some other time, it doesn't matter) and says the 'wanted you to have this part' to keep from having to reveal the truth about Vader and Anakin (that they're the same person, not victim and murderer).

The Emperor saying 'the son of skywalker' instead of 'your son'?  Well, folks, if I remember correctly, this quote is from the SSD contact near Hoth, and the script hadn't revealed the father-son relationship yet.  That's not mindgames, that's good writing.  Let's just give away the big surprise in the movie so paranoids won't latch onto it as proof that the entire series is backwards.

Your point about Obi-Wan the famous general not retiring to a dustball is moot and unbased.  You say Anakin would be at home, watching over his son, well, Ben is at home, watching over his charge.  Many people, in book and discussion, believe Obi-Wan and Yoda deliberately chose to hide Luke on Vader's homeworld, with the same last name, with a family he knew, as bait.  Obi-Wan waited in the shadows, watching over Luke as he grew and waiting to see if he drew Vader's attention.

The whole C3-PO thing... I hated him in Episode II.  I don't want to spoil, but that's exactly what he did to me.  Everything JarJar ever was, 3PO became.  One line groaners and puns.  Slapstick comedy.  'What did I do?  I just want to go hoooome!'  You said he should recognize Obi-Wan, Alf, but I think you have Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon mixed up.  Obi-Wan stayed on the ship the whole time on Tatooine in Episode I, except to load supplies.  C3PO never went on the ship, he stayed at Anakin and Shmi's house.  C3PO would know Qui-Gon, Anakin, Artoo, Padme, and JarJar, but no one else from that movie.

Anyways, I think I had to more to say, but I can't remember it.  The basic line I hold to is, Anakin is the one going over to the darkside, killing Tuskan's, resenting his master, and admiring Palpatine/Sidious.  Obi-Wan hasn't shown any sign of the darkside.
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Old 05-21-2002, 12:24 PM   #8
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Most interesting theory, Robbert, but, as others have done, I'll point out a few things, which may contribute or work against your concepts.

Note that I haven't seen AOTC yet (hopefully I will tonight ).

Why would Anakin-BEN build a new lightsabre while keeping his old one as a heirloom for his son?

Now an interesting thing to note - compare the pictures below:
Anakin's first saber from AOTC:

According to what the site tells us, this sabre was destroyed.

Now compare it to this one:
Vader's from IV:

Looks similar, doesn't it?

Luke's from IV:

And this one does look familiar too.

Now OBK's padawan sabre from Ep I:


Compare it to Qui-Gon's own:


And to his final one in Ep IV:


Images grief-linked from LuukeSabers
OBK's sabres are clearly based upon Qui-Gon's. The Anakin / Luke/ Vader sabres are utterly different. Moreover, it seems that in AOTC, Anakin uses OBK's sabre for a while, yet he clearly uses his own brand of lightsabres.

This seems to indicate that at least the accessories in the films clearly are against Robbert's theory.

OWK has never met 3PO in I.

The "Your father wanted you to have this" could well be Ben thinking that the pre-dark Anakin would have wanted his son to get the sabre.

Same with the Emperor talking about Skywalker's son: "Skywalker" being the dead pre-Vader persona. Vader himself tells Luke in RotJ that his former self is dead.

Not sure about what you get to see in AOTC, but kid Anakin is a heck of a pilot while OBK doesn't stand out as particuliarily gifted.

About the whole "balance to the Force" thingie:
In Ep I, the Sith have been reduced to Sidious and Maul (IIRC, Yoda thinks them extinct since several centuries), while there seem to be dozens if not hundreds of Jedi. I think it is quite clear that the one who would bring balance to the Force should, in fact, root out but 4 Jedi (Ben, Yoda, Luke and Leia) to close in a balance versus Sidious and Vader. Again, I could change this statement after viewing AOTC...

That's all for the time being. I'll decide after viewing AOTC for or against Robbert's theories

[edited: changed all the sabre pictures for a clearer comparison]
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Old 05-21-2002, 12:45 PM   #9
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Angry

Also, another thing a few people have missed out on,
I don't think Anakin even knew he had kids up until he met
Luke.  Wasn't it said some place that the kids were scurried
away before Vader knew they were born?

"So, you have a sister...."

As for Kenobi's line about Luke's father wanting him to have it
when he was old enough, *shrug*  Still have another movie
to go.  Maybe when Kenobi finds out about the trysts and
wedding they have a conversation in which Anakin
hypothesizes they'll have kids that will shame the Jedi in their
power and he'll give his saber to his son.

Anyway, just my two cents.  I'm still of the mind Kenobi is
Ben, Ani is Vader, and Luecas likes raping my childhood with
this travesty of a prequel.

Windu v Fett.  Yeah, like that would've gone down the way it
did after seeing the scrapping Fett gave Kenobi.  Fett got
chumped.
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Old 05-21-2002, 11:45 PM   #10
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Lightbulb

ok, i was refraining from posting, but being a HUGE star wars fan, i must comment here. first of all, robbert, awesome theory, and if it works out that way, ep 3 will be WAY awesome. (since it will probably be way predictable if he doesn't toss in a twist or three) but i was wondering two things: (and these are probably considered to be spoilers, so skip it if you don't wanna know)

1. doesn't george lucas have to approve the star wars books or SOMETHING? because in A.C.Crispin's han solo trilogy, we get a totally different background for boba fett. was anyone else irritated by this? (i personally liked her "renegade" type story better than the orphaned clone thing...) point being, why would a different story be endorsed? doesn't someone try to watch to make sure that doesn't happen? i mean, it was 5 years ago (about) when the books came out, but i'm thinking george must have at least been thinking of boba fett possiblities back then, right?
2. my other point, and perhaps i'm wrong on this, since i was in the very front row and it was hard to see... is the republic symbol the same as the empire symbol? cause the one on the clone trooper commanders' heads and obi-wan's ship looked very similar (if not identical) to the empire symbol...
i'm confused! any comments?

-likita
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Old 05-22-2002, 05:20 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by (LikitaRenn @ May 22 2002,04:45 am)
2. my other point, and perhaps i'm wrong on this, since i was in the very front row and it was hard to see... is the republic symbol the same as the empire symbol? cause the one on the clone trooper commanders' heads and obi-wan's ship looked very similar (if not identical) to the empire symbol...
 i'm confused! any comments?
Your sight is intact. The Republic's logo is the same as the Empire's, only in black and white instead of black and blue.
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Old 05-22-2002, 05:26 AM   #12
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Thumbs down

Well, I saw AOTB.

Robbert, you're completely and utterly wrong on all counts. The person who turned into Darth Vader is in reality Georges Lucas.

To spew out such a ****ty movie at his dedicated fans is clearly proof he's gone over to the dark side.

Attack of the Bore even manages to have me forgive JJB in the Phatom Menace.

:ukes::
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Old 05-22-2002, 06:58 AM   #13
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I agree with most sentiments here, that is a very well developed theory, and certainly very interesting. However, I have one point to make about your post.

Yoda DID, in fact, train Obi-Wan Kenobi. This is explained not in the movies, but on the Star Wars website and in the Visual Companion book for Attack Of The Clones. Children are meant to first begin their Jedi training at age 3-4 (might vary according to alien species, but 3-4 is the human equivalent). They start at such a young age because firstly the path to becoming a Jedi is long and hard, and an early start is needed, and secondly because younger children do not have the preconceptions and detrimental emotions already present, such as hate and anger.

This sort of training is done by - you guessed it - Yoda. A scene is visible in AOTC when Obi-Wan visits Yoda while the old Jedi master is training the Bear Clan. According to the visual companion, after children graduate from the basic training at age 9-10 or so, they are assigned to a Jedi knight or a Jedi master as padawan learner.

In part this explains why the Jedi council was so reluctant to allow Qui-Gon Jinn to train Anakin in episode 1. Qui-Gon was suggesting Anakin's basic training from ages 3-10 be skipped entirely. It's like having a kid skip school up to 6th grade and expect them go go right into junior high.

So in conclusion, Yoda DOES train Obi-Wan, and Obi-Wan's statement on Hoth was accurate. He was trained by Yoda when he was a child.
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Old 05-22-2002, 11:31 AM   #14
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*blink*

People didn't get that?
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Old 05-22-2002, 04:00 PM   #15
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Re: SW theory.

Saw a news broadcast wherein Lucas said Anakin becomes Darth Vader in episode III (not that this is really news or anything).  So, is this misdirection?  The truth?  Who knows?

However, I liked ep II, regardless of everyone's criticisms.
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Old 05-27-2002, 11:20 AM   #16
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Also, after watching all the movies a few times recently, it seems that in I and II Ewan McGregor is trying real hard to make a good imitation of Alec Guiness (watch the Ghost scene on Dagobah in VI, and then go watch II again).

Now, personally I don't think Hayden Christiensen is going to start speaking with an accent or doing nearly that good of a job imitation Alec Guiness, so it's either really good misdirection or Obi-Wan really is Old Ben .
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Old 06-02-2002, 05:02 PM   #17
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*Robbert*


  Ok im not goin to sit here and pick your theory to peices cause u do have do have some grounds to stat what u have. But *SOME* is the key word here, Ok im goin to go through your Post and tell you why ( I think ) you are wrong.

   ( dont get me wrong im not trashing you in anyway, it is Just my opinon )

  The reason I have a negitive out-look on this whole Anakin-Ben, Ben-Anakin thing is that your whole defence is build on a avidience you have made-up, you have twisted and munipulated the whole idea to suit your theory.  

For Example ----->


Quote:
Originally Posted by
Now shoot to Episode IV. In it, we first encounter Obi Wan on Tatooine (which he refers to as a 'desert rock on the outer rim' in Episode I....!, saving Luke from the Tusken Raiders. Luke says the droid, R2D2, is looking for a man named Obi Wan Kenobi. BEN sits down and says, "That is a name I have not heard in a long, long time." Later he says, "That was my name, once".
Well first off the reason he has not heard that name in a long time is because he has not seen any other jedi for years he is hiding from Vader, why use his jedi name if they are branded as out-laws, going as Ben seems safe to me on an Imperial run planet. And whats a better place to hide then Tatooine, Just like Obi-Wan say himself  ---->

" A haven for people who do not want to be found " .

Quote:
Originally Posted by
So, why would VADER come to BEN and say, "Look, man, I know we're enemies and stuff, but if I ever have a son, I want you to give him this lightsaber of mine.
Did yea ever think maybe that Anakin never wanted to give this saber to Luke, or it wasnt even his fathers but Kenobi's; it was just Obi-Wan trying to erge Luke to come with him to Alderan, just like Kenobi grunts ---->

" Im getting way to old for this stuff "

Quote:
Originally Posted by
Also in Episode IV: BEN tells VADER, on the Death Star, "You can't win, Darth. If you destroy me now, I shall become more powerful than you ever could imagine." Now, if we follow the common mentality of VADER being Anakin, this is an impossible statement, since Anakin has the highest midchlorian count ever registered - nothing can be more powerful than he.
Yes this is true but as you know what Jedi could be more powerful then the *The one to bring balance*. But we dont know what happens after death for Jedi maybe they go to plane of existeice more powerful the the one they are in now, I think he is simple stating that he will not die if he is struck down he will just go to the next stage of jedi evolution. ( yes this is as far fetched as your theory, but if u have played Jedi Knight for Computer, it has basis )

Quote:
Originally Posted by
In Episode V, on the planet of Hoth, we see the image of BEN talking to Luke. It says, "You will go to the Dagobah system. There you will learn from Yoda, the Jedi Master who taught me." Who taught Obi Wan Kenobi, folks? It sure wasn't the little green man. However, it's quite possible that, after VADER declares himself a lord of the Sith, that Anakin's training is finished by Yoda.
Yoda did train Obi-Wan in a sence, and there is proof of this. First thing frist, you got the "Quote Wrong" In Ep.5 Kenobi Clearly states "You will go to the Dagobah system. There you will learn from Yoda, the Jedi Master who *Instructed* me." not taught. After the tragic death of Qui-Gon and the sudden out-burst of Kenobi to defeat the Sith Lord Maul, Obi-Wan was at a point where he was lost, and like every Jedi when they are in need they go to Yodo the most wises jedi in the galaxy, and as we see at the end of Ep.1 Yoda and Kenobi are talking with each other. With the word "Instructed" branded into that line there is good evidence for what i am saying, And as you must know the councel *Instructs* all the Jedi, and who is one of the heads of the order, YODA, so Obi-Wan was right in saying what he did.



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On the Death Star, Palpatine taps Luke's lightsaber and suggests it is much like his fathers. Note that the lightsaber in question looks nothing like any VADER has ever used, yet is similar to the one BEN used in Episode IV
This gives my theory more evidence, as i stated in the first part of my post.

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Originally Posted by
Did yea ever think maybe that Anakin never wanted to give this saber to Luke, or it wasnt even his fathers but Kenobi's
I dont know if this is true, but if in fact if it does look more like the saber used in Ep.1, then it has pesedence.

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Originally Posted by
Obi Wan Kenobi, as seen in Episode I, would never have retired into anonymity after being a famous general during the Clone Wars. Doubly so not onto a 'desert rock on the outer rim'.
Obi-Wan Kenobi Never Retires as we find out in Ep.4 when he goes to Alderian to help the rebellion stop the dreaded Imperial Death Star. And the point you make about Kenobi living in the Outer-Rims, is mislead to, the reason he goes to Tatooine to live in the Dune Sea is to make sure he wont be found by Vader.

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Originally Posted by
In Episode VI, VADER tells Luke, right before he dies, that he wants to gaze upon his son with his own eyes. I say this is because he has come to believe the lie he began in episode V, which ultimately allowed him to save his 'son' from the evil emperor - but which is nevertheless still a lie
Ok this is just a wild-stab in the dark on your behalf, come on man that is really weak, but like i said before im not saying u are dumb for saying this, It takes brains to come up with a theory like that.

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And the Republic Logo, and the Imperial Logo are the same. And it makes sence that they are, The army and planet never change, the only thing to change is government, and when Jar Jar *shakes head* gives direct control to the Superem Chanslore (palaptine in this case) gets direct control over the army and senate, there for removing the Jedi Order and taking control of the army for his own benifet, in this case Making the Imperial Empire. This is why the Logos stay the same.
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Old 06-02-2002, 06:19 PM   #18
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Also, didn't anyone else notice the part in Ep II where Anakin and Obi-wan walk in to the bar? Obi is semi-chastising Anakin and then says, "I swear one day you'll be the death of me." Obviously, this is a joke referencing Ep IV when Darth kills Obi in front of Luke.
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