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Old 06-18-2016, 01:25 AM   #1
Newworlds
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Armegeddon Forum Policy?

Got a question.

While surfing the net to find some forums on MUDs I oddly came upon this little gem:

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...24817099,d.aXo

It is a post on the Armageddon Game Forums where the Administration encourages their players to post negativity about other games on their forums. I found this quite shocking.

While I'm not a fan of Armageddon for a variety of reasons (mainly the concept and construct of what is roleplay intensive). I have never spoken poorly about their game in the Ateraan forums or on our game. Nor does New Worlds Ateraan tolerate negativity about other games on our forums or in OOC discussion. This is because it is always one sided and almost always lacking the true facts of the game. On the contrary, I have suggested Armageddon as a viable alternative to a Roleplaying game.

I just happened to remember the player who posted when he came on the game. He was adverse to the difficulty of the roleplay involved in joining a guild on Ateraan as well as many roleplay intensive things on Ateraan that made me surprised he was an Armageddon player but couldn't handle the roleplay requirements of Ateraan. I was going to post many of his comments and refute them as silly and non factual, but my real question is this: Why is the administration of Armageddon encouraging this type of forum against other games? Could someone from Armageddon answer this question?
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Old 06-18-2016, 12:43 PM   #2
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Re: Armegeddon Forum Policy?

NewWorlds: Ateraan is a decent game. I'll probably return to this mud. However, I just can't understand one thing; Why do you want to be called roleplay intensive so badly? I liked the ooc channel and general playerbase in my brief experience. It's the style of the mud which is cool. And there is a huge playerbase with good amount of roleplay opportunities.

BTW It's unacceptable if they encourage their players to post negativity about other games, you're right.

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Old 06-18-2016, 06:00 PM   #3
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Re: Armegeddon Forum Policy?

This isn't the official GDB. Not sure but I think it is the random forum an ex plyer creqted for other ex plyers to hang out in and bitch bout Armageddon. I have never seen Armageddon staff allow something like this and while I didnt read the entire text wall ranting about New Worlds, I didnt see anything there that says the Arm staff or community would encourage it.
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Old 06-18-2016, 06:05 PM   #4
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Re: Armegeddon Forum Policy?

Yeah. After looking bit, this is the forum where disgruntled players go to gripe and share IC secrets. Armageddon staff has no control of random ex players bagging on your game there. Sorry man.
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Old 06-18-2016, 11:21 PM   #5
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Re: Armegeddon Forum Policy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Newworlds View Post
I was going to post many of his comments and refute them as silly and non factual, but my real question is this: Why is the administration of Armageddon encouraging this type of forum against other games? Could someone from Armageddon answer this question?

A quick look at the parent board reveals this little gem: http://armageddonmud.boards.net/thre...tors-alike-gdb

Quote:
objectives of these boards
the goal of these boards is to be a place for arm players, both current and former, as well as other MUD enthusiasts, to hang out and chat in a casual environment. that's it. there's no malicious or nefarious plans for armageddon mud -- or any other mud. as a registered user, you can view all threads. despite the fear-mongering from people on the GDB, you'll never see them provide any evidence or substance to backing up the claims that we're here to disrupt and ruin Arm. because we're not. it's just a place for people to hang out and chat.
Emphasis added.

So basically Mister Newworlds is just huffy about people pointing out that his empire has no clothes. I read the thread that he linked to here and he had similar issues as me with the way things are in the game--the canned emotes (and the people who use them--seriously, it's like going to the Proms or Salzburg where everyone coughs after each movement), the dippy RP, the endless stream of login announcements, the lack of a prompt, the crappy entrance requirements for guilds. Good thing he didn't try the south part with the mandatory slavery, or the corn-growing. That guy isn't merely blowing smoke, he had some legitimate issues with the game, and he's not the only one.
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Old 06-19-2016, 01:29 AM   #6
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Re: Armegeddon Forum Policy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dark acacia View Post
A quick look at the parent board reveals this little gem: http://armageddonmud.boards.net/thre...tors-alike-gdb

Emphasis added.

So basically Mister Newworlds is just huffy about people pointing out that his empire has no clothes. I read the thread that he linked to here and he had similar issues as me with the way things are in the game--the canned emotes (and the people who use them--seriously, it's like going to the Proms or Salzburg where everyone coughs after each movement), the dippy RP, the endless stream of login announcements, the lack of a prompt, the crappy entrance requirements for guilds. Good thing he didn't try the south part with the mandatory slavery, or the corn-growing. That guy isn't merely blowing smoke, he had some legitimate issues with the game, and he's not the only one.
Really? What a childish response. It is no wonder you don't like enforced roleplay. I'm not angry at the post, just curious why it was sponsored by the game. Kindly enough, Warhound set the record straight in a mature fashion to which I am grateful. To you Dark Acacia, you have the same misinformation as the poster did, let's name them:
  • Login announcments- simple to tune out.
  • Entrance to guild requirements - Complete roleplay. This is the huge part of roleplay that anyone with any roleplaying skill or desire would enjoy and embrace. Not required in all guilds though.
  • Southern creation with mandatory slavery - Wrong. You may be a slave, conscript, or servant. There is no mandatory slavery.
  • Legitimate issues with the game - Yes he did. He wanted a hack and slash game. Ateraan is not.
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Old 06-19-2016, 01:30 AM   #7
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Re: Armegeddon Forum Policy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by WarHound View Post
This isn't the official GDB. Not sure but I think it is the random forum an ex plyer creqted for other ex plyers to hang out in and bitch bout Armageddon. I have never seen Armageddon staff allow something like this and while I didnt read the entire text wall ranting about New Worlds, I didnt see anything there that says the Arm staff or community would encourage it.
Thanks for the update. I have to apologize for not digging deeper myself and seeing that this was not official.
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Old 06-19-2016, 01:50 AM   #8
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Re: Armegeddon Forum Policy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rendekar View Post
NewWorlds: Ateraan is a decent game. I'll probably return to this mud. However, I just can't understand one thing; Why do you want to be called roleplay intensive so badly?
Hello Rendekar. I don't think the argument was ever why NWA wanted to be called roleplay intensive, but rather why the few administrators of games that call themselves RPI refuse to allow anyone to use the term Roleplay Intensive that do not follow their specific set gaming conventions. I among others have argued that these conventions do not give a game a more intensive roleplay experience. Like it or not, that was the very reason for the term RPI. Not sure we've ever used the term RPI before. I think in humor we made up RPEI (roleplay enforced intensive) or something like that.

I think it would have helped this whole group to use a different term rather than than trying to claim somehow their system promotes more roleplay than any other system of required roleplay. It has been argued into the ground and the only way someone will know is to play both and see which is more intensive and engaging.

Does that make sense?
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Old 06-19-2016, 11:52 AM   #9
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Re: Armegeddon Forum Policy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Newworlds View Post
Really? What a childish response.
You don't like it so it's automatically childish. Got it.


Quote:
It is no wonder you don't like enforced roleplay.
I actually prefer to play enforced roleplay games. FORCED roleplay is another story.


Quote:
I'm not angry at the post, just curious why it was sponsored by the game.
It's not.

Quote:
Kindly enough, Warhound set the record straight in a mature fashion to which I am grateful.
More mature than you. Also, he took the time to actually see what the forum was.

Quote:
Dark Acacia
It's dark acacia.

Quote:
Entrance to guild requirements - Complete roleplay. This is the huge part of roleplay that anyone with any roleplaying skill or desire would enjoy and embrace. Not required in all guilds though.
Roleplaying is fine. Your system is broken. It shouldn't be a test to see if someone really wants to play the game--they're already online, what do you think they want to do?

Quote:
Southern creation with mandatory slavery - Wrong. You may be a slave, conscript, or servant. There is no mandatory slavery.
It's still pointless, forced roleplay that doesn't accomplish anything.

Quote:
Legitimate issues with the game - Yes he did. He wanted a hack and slash game. Ateraan is not.
No, he wanted an RP game. READ HIS ENTIRE POST. A hack-and-slash game would be RetroMUD or BatMUD or Achaea or Threshhold. RP isn't important in those places.

He even posted a log of Ateraan's magnificent RP culture in his thread, and boy is it a howler.

It's been years since I played in Ateraan, but I remember being turned off by some "event" where this one chick gathered everyone to this place where she basically copy/pasted some essay she wrote to everyone in attendance. You know how when you go to a classical music concert, everyone coughs between movements, not necessarily because they had to cough but to let you know that they know the appropriate time to cough? Well, people were using stock emotes after each paragraph, and it reminded me of that (note that I haven't been to Salzburg, but I used to listen to NPR's live transmissions from the Mozart Festival and you can hear the coughing--it's not nearly as obnoxious at the US Coast Guard Academy's public concerts). 15-20 or so people sighing, shifting, nodding, or whatever. I got bored and did something in another window, I don't remember what.
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Old 06-19-2016, 05:09 PM   #10
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Re: Armegeddon Forum Policy?

Hello dark acacia, I'll try to respond to some of your comments.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dark acacia View Post
I actually prefer to play enforced roleplay games. FORCED roleplay is another story.
Nothing in the game is forced roleplay. You start as a character with a choice of backgrounds and race. What you do with it is your own roleplay.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dark acacia View Post
Roleplaying is fine. Your system is broken. It shouldn't be a test to see if someone really wants to play the game--they're already online, what do you think they want to do?
It doesn't test that, it tests their ability to join an exclusive group. He never had to. He failed on one of the easier guilds and then again to become a guildless person. That quest is actually easier than he made it, but he didn't understand it nor did he get help from others. I remember this guy, he was better off in a game that has easy quests and easy rankings.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dark acacia View Post
No, he wanted an RP game. READ HIS ENTIRE POST.
I read his post and found that when he had the opportunity to roleplay he didn't want to. He wanted to hack and slash his way into a guild. Doesn't work that way. I know it may seem like you are FORCED to roleplay, but you aren't. He didn't even have roleplay with others if he didn't want to, but nothing is easy on NWA. You have to show some semblance of commitment to something. Should the Garrison really allow any weakling without honor into it? Should the Shaman allow those lacking a spiritual understanding into their guild, should the Merchants allow a person who only wants to battle into their fold?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dark acacia View Post
He even posted a log of Ateraan's magnificent RP culture
No he posted a singular moment in the Tavern late at night. I told you I recognized this player and he was about as far away from roleplay ability as a 13 year old on Pokemon mud.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dark acacia View Post
It's been years since I played in Ateraan, but I remember being turned off by some "event" where this one chick gathered everyone to this place where she basically copy/pasted some essay she wrote to everyone in attendance....I got bored and did something in another window, I don't remember what.
This is a standard practice when doing roleplay like a theater event, sermon, or other preplanned event. While many events utilize spontanaiety, for some it slows down the game if you aren't prepared. You likely have never been involved in a setup group roleplay event like this. I have seen 100's and many are very interactive throughout even during sermons you have great conflict after. Some roleplay events are boring, that doesn't mean the roleplayer is bad. Your interaction in roleplay defines who you are. If you do not like to engage don't blame the roleplayer you are not interacting with.

Did you ever make it into a guild on NWA?
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Old 06-20-2016, 09:04 AM   #11
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Re: Armegeddon Forum Policy?

I don't mean to hijack the thread, but, well, a couple of issues have been brought up here that I'm truly curious about.

What defines a game as "Hack 'n Slash?"

and...

There's a time and a place for everything. Sometimes a remark deserves a simple smirk and sometimes a situation demands role-play that's a lot more involved. Why the disdain for coded emits?

I love great role-play as much as anybody. I have become immersed in some fantastic, long-running stories that I would stack up against any "intense role-play" in any game anywhere. And what made it great was the people I was playing with and the staff stirring the pot behind the scenes--not the absence of coded emits or the lack of opportunity to go maul some critters and level up if I wanted to.
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Old 06-20-2016, 12:06 PM   #12
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Re: Armegeddon Forum Policy?

Stock emotes almost always have exactly one action and one specific emotion. They represent a lack of thought and interest, while custom emotes are (or at least should be) tailored to the specific instance in the situation where they are used. It's really tiresome to go somewhere and read "Person inclines his head to you" over and over. One time I responded with "You roll a marble down Person's inclined head" and it wasn't received well.

Hack 'n Slash games are games that are all about just fighting monsters. There's nothing wrong with that.
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Old 06-20-2016, 03:24 PM   #13
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Re: Armegeddon Forum Policy?

Quote:
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What defines a game as "Hack 'n Slash?"
Hack and Slash or H&S, like dark acacia said, are about fighting monsters, but the term is sometimes synonomous with games that rely on killing monsters to progress either in levels or skills or other factors. It can sometimes be considered a derogatory term to games that claim to be centered around roleplay. Evenso, H&S has its place in nearly every game I've played and it can be considered a lot of fun. Depends on your taste of gaming.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Malifax View Post
There's a time and a place for everything. Sometimes a remark deserves a simple smirk and sometimes a situation demands role-play that's a lot more involved. Why the disdain for coded emits?
I have yet to find a game that doesn't have some form of coded emotes like: smile, laugh, giggle, cry, and the like. Most of these games also have emote commands that are open ended like: emote bobby laughs heartily as he falls upon the table and chokes on the small piece of beef in his mouth.

Some games go to the extreme with this allowing for robust and complex parsing as in: emote ! jumps up an points at &bob with a %sword while displaying a %knife toward &joe. If you were bob this would appear as: Karen jumps up and points at you with a sleek bladed long sword while displaying a emerald dagger toward joe. For example.

In NWA we have coded emotes, open ended emotes, pmotes, omotes, tmotes, some of which are parser emotes and some not. Some games like the fuller parcer robust emotes which I am not a fan of.

In the end, you are absolutely right Malifax, the style doesn't matter so much as the player behind it. :-)
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Old 06-20-2016, 05:22 PM   #14
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Re: Armegeddon Forum Policy?

Thanks for the replies. I grew up playing Gemstone, Legends of Futures Past and Inferno, all three commercial games that together ran from the mid-80's until 2006 or so. I've had almost zero exposure to the world of free MUDs and as a result get quickly lost when community abbreviations, acronyms and terms are used in a discussion. My perspective on MUDs tends to be a little different than most folks'.
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Old 06-20-2016, 11:15 PM   #15
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Re: Armegeddon Forum Policy?

Quote:
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Thanks for the replies. I grew up playing Gemstone, Legends of Futures Past and Inferno, all three commercial games that together ran from the mid-80's until 2006 or so. I've had almost zero exposure to the world of free MUDs and as a result get quickly lost when community abbreviations, acronyms and terms are used in a discussion. My perspective on MUDs tends to be a little different than most folks'.
Ha! You should have seen me when I first started a MUD years ago. Fun times.

Glad we could help.
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Old 06-21-2016, 07:35 PM   #16
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Re: Armegeddon Forum Policy?

You know what, I was going to ignore Newworlds' salty tears in this thread, but now I think it's time for me to try Ateraan again after who knows how many years and actually update my list of criticisms of that game.

...I just have to find the time now.

EDIT: why is "ateraan corn planting" trending on DuckDuckGo? I hated the corn planting system, by the way.

Last edited by dark acacia : 06-21-2016 at 07:41 PM.
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Old 06-21-2016, 11:36 PM   #17
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Re: Armegeddon Forum Policy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dark acacia View Post
You know what, I was going to ignore Newworlds' salty tears in this thread, but now I think it's time for me to try Ateraan again after who knows how many years and actually update my list of criticisms of that game.

...I just have to find the time now.

EDIT: why is "ateraan corn planting" trending on DuckDuckGo? I hated the corn planting system, by the way.
I am thankful that you did not ignore the tears and you are willing to come back to Ateraan. It is always helpful to have good constructive criticism that will make the world a better place.
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Old 06-25-2016, 11:21 AM   #18
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Re: Armegeddon Forum Policy?

Eh. This entire thread looks like yet another attempt to advertise the OP's game without actually advertising the OP's game. The OP prides himself on attention to detail, and yet he was unable to notice that the website of his concern was NOT an official site of the game? First rule of the WWW - which should be a matter of habit for any self-respecting game developer: know your source.

He didn't even CHECK his source. Again - just another plug for his game as far as I'm concerned.
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Old 06-26-2016, 03:02 PM   #19
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Re: Armegeddon Forum Policy?

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Eh. This entire thread looks like yet another attempt to advertise the OP's game without actually advertising the OP's game. The OP prides himself on attention to detail, and yet he was unable to notice that the website of his concern was NOT an official site of the game? First rule of the WWW - which should be a matter of habit for any self-respecting game developer: know your source.

He didn't even CHECK his source. Again - just another plug for his game as far as I'm concerned.
Really? Is it at all possible for you to live in reality?

By posting here it was much more efficient, effective, and successful to verify the source rather than researching Armageddon and the web to find out what forums are related or not.
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Old 06-26-2016, 06:32 PM   #20
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Re: Armegeddon Forum Policy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Newworlds View Post
Really? Is it at all possible for you to live in reality?

By posting here it was much more efficient, effective, and successful to verify the source rather than researching Armageddon and the web to find out what forums are related or not.
No, it was much more efficient to read the first post on the announcements subforum of THAT forum that you "happened" to visit, which is at the very top of the main forum, in bold, separated from the rest of the forum. In fact, the post that you could've found this out very easily with, was the "latest post" on that subforum, called: to new and old visitors alike from the GDB

If you had read that one single post, at the very top of the forum there, in the Announcements section, you would have seen the purpose of the forum, which specifies it's for ex-players, current players, and ex-staffers. Not exactly something you'd expect to see from an "official" game site.

And then there's the very next stickied thread, warning people not to post anything that could identify themselves so as to prevent them from being banned from the game...

And if that wasn't enough to convince you, the very top of the board, there's a quoted "testimonial":

"The original point of their community is to say crappy things about ours and help people cheat." - some cat lady

But no - you felt it was more efficient, effective, and successful to post your criticism first, then discover your criticism was 100% groundless by waiting for someone here on a totally other website to point it out to you?

You've supported my opinion even more firmly: you only post here to advertise, and use thinly veiled opinions about things in general just to get your game's name bumped up to the top of the recent topics list.
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